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Thread: ASBA Breeding Panel Report- well worth the read

  1. #61
    Super Moderator Stallion mango will become famous soon enough mango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Nalder View Post
    Mango,


    First up this is about a debate & not about giving it to one another. I do understand and respect the right of others having an opinion, however one needs to fully understand all the information around the issue, prior to going out and saying something that is just not on the mark.


    Let me try and respond to each one of your points.


    To my knowledge it ( funds from import fees) was never going into fillies & mares races. The subject of Fillies & Mares Races in a separate issue / debate that we can get into latter.
    HRA told each State that the funds derived from Import fees was to be used on Breeding assistance to breeders generally. HRNSW has tied several things to this end.
    Your opinion on weather or not the Colonial Stallion incentive is worth anything needs to be based around some form of factual information. Let me make a point that needs to be made, CB fee structure was decided upon well in advance of the Colonial incentive from HRNSW Being made public. Once we found out about what HRNSW was doing we tried to help further by paying for the Foals Rego fee. In other words we endeavoured to match a positive with another positive. So the big winner is the Breeder on both counts from HRNSW & The Blaster team. Further more we instigated / organised to undertake a full survey by contacting each Breeder via electronic media and asked a raft of questions that ended up totalling 20 pages. This was carried out after the yearling sales had been completed. These finding / results was then made available to the interested parties. To say it did or did not help the Blaster I could not answer, as we had nothing factually to compare him to. Next year / this coming session we should have a better understanding of same. What I can tell you is that all existing Stallions that qualified under the Colonial Stallion assistance system, all covered more mares than at any time over the previous 2 - 3 years. This to me reflects a positive trend that needs to be followed up.


    All our planning was based on CB covering 100 + mares in his 1st year, and this he did. We could have been somewhat bullish in our assessment but you need to aim for a target & go for it.


    Anything that helps and assists Breeders in anyway in my mind is great for the industry.


    Now on to your next points.


    HRNSW have been trying a range of things that all help the Breeder. For instance, they have lowered the cost of Breeders Challenge eligibility by around $90 + Another $90.00 saving if you go into the Breeders Challenge you no longer have to pay any Naming fees. Both of these savings to Breeders & Owners, have taken up all, everything from what HRA has given to HRNSW to put back into Breeding, in my opinion. The spend on both of these two items alone is massively over what the Stallion Incentive System has given back to the Breeders. But once again it is about trying to cover as many people as you can.


    I know our foal numbers are declining Nationally & internationally also. This is a World Wide trend. But one very major positive that we all need to understand, NSW with everything HRNSW are doing & have done over recent years has resulted in this State showing the least percentage decline against all other States & NZ. Furthermore if you go back just a couple of years ago and look at 2011 & 2012 Breeding results NSW had in fact shown two consecutive breeding years of growth in foal numbers. So it can be done.
    That of reversing the trends.


    What we need to understand is that it is not about you & I, it is about HRNSW looking after as many of us as can be done, so everyone has a bit of what they feel is important to them.


    Finally if you have anything positive you feel that "The Blaster" should be doing to help with foal numbers please let us know.


    All the Best.
    Hi Rob

    Thanks for the reply and you have cleared a bit up for me

    CHEERS

    DALLAS

  2. #62
    Senior Member 4YO eliteblood has a spectacular aura about eliteblood's Avatar
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    This is an interesting discussion and all points of view are valid.
    It is conceivable that a Colonial Stallion rebate could be absorbed by the stallion owner by way of the service fee being set higher than would otherwise have been the case.
    The Colonial Stallion incentive is selective in that it provides no benefit to mare owners who prefer to breed to an imported stallion.
    Increasing the earning potential and therefore the value of fillies and mares is IMO the single most significant opportunity to assist the struggling breeding industry.

    Having said that, how big a boost would it be to our breeding industry and everybody involved if we could get to a situation whereby our top colts were able to retire with substantial stud values (ala the Golden Slipper winner in the thoroughbred world). How much better off would we all be if most of our service money stayed onshore in the pockets of our own country's owners and breeders with the likelihood that much of it would be reinvested within the industry. Wouldn't it be good to be selling yearling colts with a potential sire value factored into the prices.
    Having had access to the worlds best stallions for 20 odd years now, I think we are closer than ever before to breeding colts whose credentials stand alongside those from North America. Will we ever overcome the perception that our horses are inferior and the prejudice shown to them as stallion prospects? I don't think it will happen in my lifetime. It is still a long road to be traveled and the Colonial Stallion rebate is a small step along the way. I think it has merit and should be supported.

    What else would assist in making that goal more achievable?
    - A Miracle Mile type race all setup at Menangle on a hot summer afternoon for 3YO colts to run world class times ?
    - Restrictions on the number of mares a stallion can serve each year ?

  3. #63
    Senior Member 3YO Gtrain has a spectacular aura about Gtrain's Avatar
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    The first suggestion seems a LOT more likely that the second Trevor. Definately a void in the schedule is an all out speed test for 3yos. I always wondered why the Len Smith was introduced for FFAs when the race mirrors the race that It's namesake introduced sixty years beforehand. I don't think your the first to suggest that one either Trevor but certainly seems a great idea. A race like that could look to build a carnival feel to Miracle Mile time. Instead of dropping all the group 1s on Len Smith and MM day, have more than one "feature" day. The 3yo could be the showpiece event on one of the prelims for the MM day. May lead to an invite to the MM for a 3yo..... Certainly would be appealing!

  4. #64
    Member Yearling Rob Nalder will become famous soon enough
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    Red face

    Trevor & Grant,


    If the Stallion owner tried to pick up the $500 incentive the market & HRNSW would in my opinion respond accordingly.


    Trevor, you are 100% correct in that the Incentive as offered by HRNSW is very selective in targeting Breeders - Mares going to a Colonial Breed Stallion over Imported / Shuttled Stallions. This is exactly why it has been done - set up. Nothing more nothing less. It is trying to attract support for Home Grown Product over the others.


    What is being lost in this debate is that over the past 2- 3 years now HRNSW has offered incentives for Breeders - Mares of $500.00 to Breed a Foal then the next lot of Incentives was to Breed a Foal from a Mare not Breed from the year prior. Once again @ $500.00 going the Breeder. I know what was paid out on both of the above incentives & it did assist Breeders. Further more under the New Stallion Colonial Incentive this has also made a great difference in assisting Breeders that have gone this way. Is that not a great thing!


    Did this raft of incentives / work, yes in my opinion anything that helps and assists Breeders is a great step forward.


    Let us give The Board of HRNSW & Management credit for trying to find a positive to work with, all they are doing is now looking at another direction to attack in a positive way.


    As I have previously stated to the Board & Management of HRNSW, has it worked for the Blaster, I can't answer this as we had no previously set of results to compare with. However if you look at the other Stallions that came under this incentive then it is no doubt it has worked as all such Stallions had massive percentage increases to mare numbers covered. Coupled with our finding based on a survey organised / undertaken with input I might add from both HRNSW & HRA.


    I should also outline that "The Blaster Team" organised this fully independent survey carried out with all Breeders (Studs excluded) that had gone to the "Blaster" so as help / assist in finding there thoughts on a stack of questions. It was undertaken electronically & included 20 odd pages of results. This along with unedited replies was passed onto HRNSW & Management. The outcome - results give a very clear response to a stack of issues over the vast majority of Breeders that came back to us on same.


    Once again as I have said the next view years will see who was right, having said that what is a better way, is there some other way that can & will help grow our Foal numbers?


    If anyone has something let us all know what it is.


    Now on racing matters outlined by Trevor / Grant, all I can say is NSWHRC & HRNSW are working together & through / towards a heap of alternatives that are looking to be massive changes if implemented, over the next few years. I could not support you BOTH more on changes & possible redirection of major Group Ones for NSW!


    But like everything we need to see the positive & or negatives prior to undertaking any changes.


    Just a quick one Grant, my view on Fillies & Mares Racing is very - very simple. The only way of making any difference is to implement Racing to Keep the Sexes divided. In other Words Fillies & Mares race together & never cross over until at Free For All level.


    Keep the Dream going by Breeding a Foal, is what we all need to spread the message on.


    All the Best,


    Rob Nalder

  5. #65
    Senior Member 2YO jackthepunter will become famous soon enough
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    Imo if the sport ever wants to increase foal numbers, their needs to be a massive increase in prize money for the everyday country horse. The prize money Australia wide for these horses is pathetic. How can you expect owners/breeders to keep breeding and buying horse, when most of the time their racing for on average $4000 for a win. That wouldn't even come close to covering the cost of just that preparation for the horse. Their is far to much money around for two years, which imo is ruining alot of horses by racing them to hard to early and for the whole season, because owners and trainers know their is no money in the sport after their 2-3 year old season. As a result alot of horses and burned out by the end of their 4 year old season, which imo is why alot of these horses don't go on to be any good as open age horses.

  6. #66
    Super Moderator Stallion mango will become famous soon enough mango's Avatar
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