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Thread: ASBA Breeding Panel Report- well worth the read

  1. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by triplev123 View Post
    Here's The Big Mile & Friends at Bondi Beach.
    Yeah awaiting the next load of contraband horseflesh from across the Tasman.

    Better go, there is a container floating off Coogee and it has my Mach Three in it.

    Time for a rap?

    Yo yo yo, its me cuzzy bro,
    slapping an import fee aint the way to go.

  2. #52
    nat
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    Where did this all go left when I filled out the survey I just wanted equality in the fillies and mares and in the trotters in the futurities and a set plan for age racing so there is a goal to breeding and racing 2-3 & 4yld horses I have a few horse that are either NZ bred out of NZ mares or by NZ stallions and every time I register in a different state or breed to a NZ stallion it cost more. Putting up fees was the last thing in my head "WOW" just what I need as a Breeder Owner and Trainer more costs " Ive found a good horse now it will cost $20,000 instead of $15,000 Yeh its in NZ" " Ive found good broodmare in foal with a colt at foot But their in NZ" people I know would rather not have a horse if they had to settle for inferior one because of cost not everyone who buys from NZ is a millionaire. Look at all the good NZ horses we have seen brought and raced in Australia buy Australians don't drive people away from buying the best product available whether it be an Aussie or NZ horse how many NZ bred broodmares are out there in Australia ask yourself why. I don't want to see organizations and races propped up at the expense of Owners & Breeders the state bodies get enough now from me for a hobby.

  3. #53
    Super Moderator Stallion mango will become famous soon enough mango's Avatar
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    Was just wondering if anyone could explain to me how putting up the import fee has helped breeding in any way. The import fee was increased 3-4 yrs ago and I thought the money was to be directed into a broodmare scheme to help put more foals on the ground.

  4. #54
    Member Yearling Rob Nalder will become famous soon enough
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    Wink

    Mango,

    From the get go let me say I do not agree with the import fee based on the fact Australia and NZ have a free trade agreement in place, so how it can be done in my view is very questionable.

    Having said that HRNSW has recieved major funds from HRA to reinvest back into Breeding initiatives. From memory it has been around the $300,000 mark per annum. HRNSW has done so by putting into place things such as more Breeding Bonus's for NSW breed horses, also the Colonial Stallion Incentive scheme is another one that I know off. They may have done some other things also that I do not know about.

    One thing I do know is that the increase in import fees has resulted in more horses coming into our state than ever before from NZ, so the fees are now just part of purchasing a Horse from NZ.

    Each of our accredited Breeding assosiasions would know more about how the funding generated from import fees has been reinvested back into Breeding incentives. Hopefully they can jump in and further expand on same.

    I will make a point of finding out exactly dollars raised and funds invested back into our sport via HRNSW and get back to you on same, hopefully by tomorrow.

    All the best

  5. #55
    Senior Member 3YO Gtrain has a spectacular aura about Gtrain's Avatar
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    Rob, while I understand and appreciate the concept behind the Colonial Stallion Incentive scheme, but I sense that NSW Studs, being more than aware of this incentive, have priced eligible colonial stallions slightly higher full well knowing that the breeder will pay $500 less. Good initiative but may have run its course. A Vicbred/BOBS/BC style bonus scheme for colonial sires may promote this breeding more. Interested to hear others thoughts if there is anyone left on this forum!!

    Also, I'm certainly not taking a shot at you re your stallion either as I have previously stated on here that I thought he was fantastically promoted. However I have also said on here that Ithought he was slightly overpriced but I'm pretty sure that was before the colonial stallion scheme was implemented so definately not accusing you of anything!!

  6. #56
    Member Yearling Rob Nalder will become famous soon enough
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    Red face

    Gtrain,

    The Blasters fee was set prior to the Colonial Stallion Incentive. I don't understand what you are saying about Stallion owners setting the Stud fee higher than it should be thinking they will get more mares. This would see the stallion owners ending up cutting there own throughts, as Breeders are always the best gage to judge if a stallion is going to get a chance at Stud carrier. The Incentive by the way is going to the Breeder not the Stallion owner. If you look at the criteria based around this Stallion incentive it is to help Breeders by going to our own home grown Grand Circuit performers. HRNSW has tried several different types of incentives to intice breeding numbers. For this endeavour I give them 10 out of 10. The nett result is that the few eligible Stallions this year all did better than the previous session in gaining mares to cover. I think the Blaster probably got the majority of mares under this scheme. His first session at Stud. Only because the breeders that went to him thought he represents what they are looking for at the Fee set for his 1st session. Having said that the Blaster covered 110 mares with 80 percent 42 Day positives so year one was a good result when he went off to stud late in the year. This season coming up ,we are looking at trying to crack the 150 mark in mare numbers. If we can then it will all be up to his off spring to deliver what we feel he will. Just imagine if what I hear is correct and Bettor's ends up going to $19,000. Just incredible to contemplate. Grant, you are in titled to your opinion and in no way am I upset by what you have expressed as we all need to have a view on what works best. Until we get fixed stallion numbers we will always do it hard in getting a spread of mares, thus effectively lowering costs to breed a foal.

    All the best and I do look forward to following other people's thoughts and views a stack of issues,

  7. #57
    Senior Member 3YO Gtrain has a spectacular aura about Gtrain's Avatar
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    Rob I really appreciate the debate and value your opinion on this. It may be the cynic in me but history indicates that when a rebate on anything is offered it almost inevitably leads to an inflated price. I understand that it may not help to get more mares but if you were going to stand your stallion for $2200 as that is what you value him at, hypothetically speaking, and that is what you think breeders will have him valued at, then putting his fee at $2500 or $2700 isn't completely out of reason full well knowing that breeders then see that price as $2000 or $2200 with the HRNSW to cover the excess.

    I thought the incentive was a fantastic head start our colonial sides had on the "opposition" when it was announced AFTER stallion fees had been set for the season. I may be cynical but government rebates throughout history have worked this way.

    Let's not forget that CB did offer free foal registration also. Now THAT is an offer that I find it hard to be cynical about!

    Further to this, I feel that a rebate will do nothing to assist progeny yearling sale prices. Well I know it certainly won't positively effect it. I keep thinking that a breeders bonus scheme for when the horse begins racing helps foal value throughout its career.

    I think we are on the same page about increasing foal numbers. Sustainability of our industry needs more successful Australian owned stallions. My feeling is the rebate worked for season 1. Let's look elsewhere and continue to think outside the box to find another way to promote and encourage breeding to Australian owned stallions.
    Last edited by Gtrain; 05-26-2015 at 10:58 AM.

  8. #58
    Super Moderator Stallion mango will become famous soon enough mango's Avatar
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    Hi Rob

    Thankyou for your reply, first of all I would like to say congrats on C B first year at stud. I thought when the import fee was increased it was for a broodmare scheme, more fillies mare's race's which would of worked if all states got together and worked it out. I for one don't agree with H.r.n.s.w putting money from the import fee towards the Colonial stallions incentive. Broodmare owners select there stallion choices for a whole wide range of reasons such as type, size, crosses and what they can afford and what is commercial come sale time. If h.r.n.s.w wanted to help by using the import fee they should of put it towards lowering rego fee's for foals that way every broodmare owner in n.s.w would of got something from the import fee and just not the people who choose to go to a Colonial bred stallion.

  9. #59
    Member Yearling Rob Nalder will become famous soon enough
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    Mango,


    First up this is about a debate & not about giving it to one another. I do understand and respect the right of others having an opinion, however one needs to fully understand all the information around the issue, prior to going out and saying something that is just not on the mark.


    Let me try and respond to each one of your points.


    To my knowledge it ( funds from import fees) was never going into fillies & mares races. The subject of Fillies & Mares Races in a separate issue / debate that we can get into latter.
    HRA told each State that the funds derived from Import fees was to be used on Breeding assistance to breeders generally. HRNSW has tied several things to this end.
    Your opinion on weather or not the Colonial Stallion incentive is worth anything needs to be based around some form of factual information. Let me make a point that needs to be made, CB fee structure was decided upon well in advance of the Colonial incentive from HRNSW Being made public. Once we found out about what HRNSW was doing we tried to help further by paying for the Foals Rego fee. In other words we endeavoured to match a positive with another positive. So the big winner is the Breeder on both counts from HRNSW & The Blaster team. Further more we instigated / organised to undertake a full survey by contacting each Breeder via electronic media and asked a raft of questions that ended up totalling 20 pages. This was carried out after the yearling sales had been completed. These finding / results was then made available to the interested parties. To say it did or did not help the Blaster I could not answer, as we had nothing factually to compare him to. Next year / this coming session we should have a better understanding of same. What I can tell you is that all existing Stallions that qualified under the Colonial Stallion assistance system, all covered more mares than at any time over the previous 2 - 3 years. This to me reflects a positive trend that needs to be followed up.


    All our planning was based on CB covering 100 + mares in his 1st year, and this he did. We could have been somewhat bullish in our assessment but you need to aim for a target & go for it.


    Anything that helps and assists Breeders in anyway in my mind is great for the industry.


    Now on to your next points.


    HRNSW have been trying a range of things that all help the Breeder. For instance, they have lowered the cost of Breeders Challenge eligibility by around $90 + Another $90.00 saving if you go into the Breeders Challenge you no longer have to pay any Naming fees. Both of these savings to Breeders & Owners, have taken up all, everything from what HRA has given to HRNSW to put back into Breeding, in my opinion. The spend on both of these two items alone is massively over what the Stallion Incentive System has given back to the Breeders. But once again it is about trying to cover as many people as you can.


    I know our foal numbers are declining Nationally & internationally also. This is a World Wide trend. But one very major positive that we all need to understand, NSW with everything HRNSW are doing & have done over recent years has resulted in this State showing the least percentage decline against all other States & NZ. Furthermore if you go back just a couple of years ago and look at 2011 & 2012 Breeding results NSW had in fact shown two consecutive breeding years of growth in foal numbers. So it can be done.
    That of reversing the trends.


    What we need to understand is that it is not about you & I, it is about HRNSW looking after as many of us as can be done, so everyone has a bit of what they feel is important to them.


    Finally if you have anything positive you feel that "The Blaster" should be doing to help with foal numbers please let us know.


    All the Best.

  10. #60
    Senior Member 3YO Gtrain has a spectacular aura about Gtrain's Avatar
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    Thanks for the reply Rob. Some very good, statistically based points. HRNSW does seem the most active state in trying to increase foal numbers and to myself as a breeder, I feel the reduction in Breeders Challenge/Foal nomination and drop of the naming fee are good steps. I was never quite sure why we did ever have to pay a naming fee as to the self confessed uninformed, it did seem a large fee in comparison to the actual job at hand.

    I also attended one of the breeding seminars HRNSW put on and found it to be an extremely valueable and informative excerise. Another great incentive.

    Im not pot shotting HRNSW as I can see how active it is in stimulating breeding in this state. I still (cynical old me), think that the Stallion Rebate may have run its course and doubt its ability to increase foal numbers. I feel it isnt entirely assisting the breeder for my previous mentioned reasons.

    I am attracted to breed to Victorian based stallions, and have done in the past, as I feel their Vicbred scheme is still superior to ours, although Breeders Challenge is slowly closing the gap.

    I hope this discussion can continue and some great feasible ideas are generated because I am sure that there are more than the three of us who feel strongly about this.

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