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Not sure either Flashing i alway's thought it was urine post race as all horses are not blood tested post race
I think it is blood tests that test for the TC02, not the urine tests? Although I am not sure either.Originally Posted by Greg Hando
Not sure either Flashing i alway's thought it was urine post race as all horses are not blood tested post race
Have whoever you want on but don't ever have yourself on
pre race blood tests are for tco2, the stewards know exactly who is doing it before a positive is produced, hence the swiftness in which they got these positives.. these blokes horses would be showing up repeatedly high levels but being just under the 36 threshold - just a matter of time and cunningness to catch them... the 2 hour arrival at menangle is to stop people drenching them an hour before the race (pretty much perfect timing to get away with it), especially the people who live close to the track
i'd like to see all tco2 results made public, if not at least public to every owner of that horse - at least then the owner can say no i think something is going on here im leaving or they can stay and cannot plead ignorance when a positive occurs
urine is for other banned substances
I do know 100% that pre and post race blood tests are for TC02. I have always been under the impression that TC02 reading is not given with post race urine, not sure where I got that impression from (or even if it is correct) but I am sure I can either find out or someone else on this forum will know definitively.Either way, 1.5 hour - 2 hour post race TC02 nips all this in the bud, regardless. Especially since the TC02 level will drop immediately following a race (hence TC02 swabs immediately after the race are not as effective as ones 2 hours after etc).
I was completely unaware that there were high TC02 readings in NSW recently, have been pretty swamped with work. Just want to make sure that my comments are taken to be in general, rather than directed at any person or state. I have voiced a number of times my support for post race TC02 testing and applauded tracks such as Menangle requiring 2 hour arrival times. This is not me jumping on some positive swab bandwagon - my views were formed long before this thread
In NZ all runners in randomly selected races are pre race blood sampled for TCO2 testing only. All these tests are pre racewhile selected runners from each race are post race tested for a selection of other drugs. All pre race testing is for TCO2 at max 34mml / litre of blood plasma.
speaking of tco2, someone might find these old videos interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6tw2...eature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10tMqdt4O0o
Doubled123 , thank you for posting that.
Part 2 gave the me the most laughs, " I can honestly say" hahahaha
[VVV] I've always maintained that the biggest of all Heads Up with that stable back then was the way in which their starters used to have their racetrack arrivals 'staggered'. Normally a Trainer with multiple starters throughout the course of a meeting would bring them all to the track in one lot at or around the same time...but old mate used to bring them over in dribs & drabs & seemingly very much depending on their go forward times. Rather curiously as far as I can recall Roger & Ronny never so much as blinked an eyelid at this rather odd practice. Could never quite work that out. 'tis a funny old world at times eh?
[VVV] Blood only Greg. TC02 is a measure of the Total Carbon Dioxide present in and able to be 'liberated' from the plasma section of whole blood, be it venous, arterial or capillary.
It's measured in mmol/L and it has a reportable range along with reference ranges depending on whether it is venous or arterial blood. In this particular instance however capillary is never used when testing TC02 in racehorses & in fact that end of TC02 testing exists for almost exclusive use with sick or infirmed infants, and especially so new borns, where sample volumes are obviously going to be much smaller.
There are a host of factors which can serve to influence TC02 readings including sampling procedures/handling/transport/time elapsed from sample collection to testing, age, fitness level, diet, water intake, sex, given time of day, climate, temperature, underlying disease or genetic disorder, anti-coagulant used in collection tubes & the accuracy of the ASE approved controls which allow for the correct cailbration of testing equipment (currently it's a Beckman ELISE platform/instrument I believe).
One thing that few people may realise is that Blood, being a living thing in itself, will continue to metabolise in the tube post collection until such time as its temperature is dropped to a point where this ceases. Theoretically, as blood obviously requires and so absorbs Oxygen and duly gives of C02, the TC02 level in an incorrectly handled sample could 'increase' post collection. I'll have to run that by Mrs. Triple but I'm pretty sure that is a possibility.
Both...however Post Race testing is far more definitive...Pre Race usually only catches the needy, the greedy and the sloppy.
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