Harness racing shame

[Old Frank]

Hi Harvey

I don't know were you get your information from.,but maybe you should get a new source .

The race Day security turned up at 7.00 am on M.M morning.
The ONLY other race to have this security was the Truere at Bankstown, which Washakie won so well. not the Cordina night as you thought

My info is straight from the person responsible for making these decisions so I think he might know

I personally have had enough of all this he said, she said stuff.
A similar thread on this has already run it's race and been closed .
It is starting to look as though I have a personal vendetta or something which I do not.
I have just been airing my own thoughts, and sometimes correcting some misinformation
I believe that Luke is a very good trainer, but on his own admission "quote I don't do much with them on the track" to me rules out these sudden improved performances by physical training
He may be a great reader of a horse and see's things that even the best haven't seen .
He may just be the best farrier to have ever put a shoe on a horse.
He is certainly one very special driver.
I've been told he has great staff.
There are probably a 100 reasons why his horses would go good.
But the thing that I have been saying is in my experience I have never seen these sort of performances at the scale that he is achieving.
I have said in previous threads if he is achieving it on training alone than IMO he is the best trainer we have ever seen ( and he just may be only time will tell)

I have been getting stacks of private messages from near and far from people who have the same questions ,but choose to stay out of the public domain.

So unless someone comes up with an outrages post on this subject , I will not be posting on this topic again.

For mine, I think Luke is the best trainer/driver in the last 20yrs throughout Australia.

He is literally hitting his straps now as a Trainer because when in Brisbane, most were in Dad John's name while Luke was developing as a Trainer / Driver in his own right.

Remember everyone, he did have horses like Slipnslide, Fluer De Lil, For A Reason when still in Brisbane, yet travelled them and won feature races in multiple states.

His success may seem 'overnight' but in my opinion is very far from that.

It's plain and simple to see that owners with any amount of common sense are ringing his number off the hook wanting him to take their horses so at the moment, he's probably knocking back initially or taking on and trialling, then culling the ones he doesn't want and is maintaining a high-performance team. Nothing wrong with this methodology as it get's results and is nothing different to what the likes of Waller and Waterhouse do at the gallops.

He is the best driver at Menangle by so far it's not funny. The majority of drivers at Menangle are quite literally pathetic and it has to be the worst crop of 'Metro' status drivers I've seen in 20-30yrs.

I'm of the understanding he has a good, strong staff underneath him and he runs his place sharp, getting the job done with which a happy team is a good team with any business. His workers I assume would all be getting rewarded, plus they are seeing their efforts supporting him achieve success on the track. A young man like Rue is getting mammoth enjoyment I would think just driving the calibre of horse in that barn, let alone the number of winners and the flow on extra $ that comes from his winning percentages.

The quote made above "I don't do much with them on the track" I think has been mis-represented a little and I've heard the same but it was in context that he doesn't burn them up at home and over work them which fundamentally is old school methods.

From my understanding, swimming and galloping are big part of his methodology and his focus appears to be on recuperation during the week, knowing full well that they will go to the races and have to spin off good times to win races consistently. Once your racing consistently with 51's and 52's next to your name, you don't have to keep burning them up at home during the week, they are already fit and it's about maintenance, much the same as NRL and AFL clubs do during the season, all their base fitness is done off-season or in a horses case, his 6-8 weeks pre-prep work before trialling/going to the races.

Luke took over a well established set-up at Cobbitty with his move down here and from what I hear has transformed it ten-fold again so good luck to him. He's investing in his and his families future so full bloody credit goes to him I say. Remember this is his business so it's no different to a businessman expanding and growing, employing good staff and becoming efficient with his methods and stock.

I think HRNSW should do more promotion on the back of McCarthy as he's easily the most marketable young man since Brian Hancock in the 80's and 90's and out of what's been a disgraceful 2011, 2012 and the future of harness racing in this state should run alongside this man's success. This young man should be featuring in the mainstream racing media weekly as his success is akin to a Chris Waller at the gallops, albeit the Harness Ind. does not have the 'sexy' projection of the gallops.

I wish their were more young men coming through the likes of him. As a horseman, he plays everyone in this state off a break he's that far better and I congratulate him and wish him every success in the future. He is a very well presented young man in the media when interviewed and his team is presneted first rate, why wouldn't owners be clamoring to have a horse in his barn? 90+% of Harness Trainers and Drivers present themselves like shit at the races so who can take them seriously and so-called 'professional'.

The bigots who lambast him simply aren't good enough to train or drive like him and it's just jealousy at it's finest.

Well done Luke, keep up the success.

P.S: Footnote, for the record, I am completely independent in my opinions and I do not have any involvement with the McCarthy stable, no horse ownership with anyone in the industry and can only lay claim to having a passing polite hello with Luke and his father John at the races previously.

[A BIT DUSTY]

I did say I wasn't going to post anymore on this thread and was quite enjoying Old Franks Post until this little bit comes along.

The bigots who lambast him simply aren't good enough to train or drive like him and it's just jealousy at it's finest.

And you know what I seem to have read the same rhetoric from supporters of Ben Johnston, Marion Jones, Chris Gleeson , the Chinese Women's Swimming team, etc etc.etc
And those who dared to question their sudden improved performances where also portrayed by the ignorant in a similar fashion as this pathetic statement .

And you know what in all of that inspiring testimony ,I still didn't see an explanation for the dramatic improved performances.

[Old Frank]

I did say I wasn't going to post anymore on this thread and was quite enjoying Old Franks Post until this little bit comes along.

The bigots who lambast him simply aren't good enough to train or drive like him and it's just jealousy at it's finest.

And you know what I seem to have read the same rhetoric from supporters of Ben Johnston, Marion Jones, Chris Gleeson , the Chinese Women's Swimming team, etc etc.etc

And those who dared to question their sudden improved performances where also portrayed by the ignorant in a similar fashion as this pathetic statement .

And you know what in all of that inspiring testimony ,I still didn't see an explanation for the dramatic improved performances.

With the point highlighted above, one could say the same goes for you ABD. I certainly haven't read everyone of your posts (nor intend too), but haven't sighted any evidence from you to support your poorly veiled insinuations that Luke's success is down to anything but drug use.

[A BIT DUSTY]

With the point highlighted above, one could say the same goes for you ABD. I certainly haven't read everyone of your posts (nor intend too), but haven't sighted any evidence from you to support your poorly veiled insinuations that Luke's success is down to anything but drug use.

Frank to borrow another forum users quote If it looks like a rat, smells like a rat, it usually is a Rat . All Iv'e ever asked is for someone to convince me it isn't a Rat.
Sounds like a reasonable request. But all I've received so far is how good a bloke he is , how good a driver he is, bla bla bloody bla .Which I have agreed with a hundred times .
But nobody has offered a plausible explanation for improved performances on a scale that I personally have never seen before.

P.S I don't believe I have ever stated that I think he is using Drugs.

[Old Frank]

Frank to borrow another forum users quote If it looks like a rat, smells like a rat, it usually is a Rat . All Iv'e ever asked is for someone to convince me it isn't a Rat.
Sounds like a reasonable request. But all I've received so far is how good a bloke he is , how good a driver he is, bla bla bloody bla .Which I have agreed with a hundred times .
But nobody has offered a plausible explanation for improved performances on a scale that I personally have never seen before.

P.S I don't believe I have ever stated that I think he is using Drugs.

ABD, please don't go all back pedal on us now. Your post #62 openly infers drug use / drug cheats when the topic you and I were bantering back and forth was L.McCarthy. At least have the gumption to stand by your inference.

You state nobody has a plausible explanation for McCarthy's success, yet you base your statements and inferences of him and his stables performance on the 'smells a rat' theory! Weak to say the least.

Currently - L.McCarthy - no positive swabs / no involvement in steward rorting and no charges for driving offences in recent memory, yet winning races consistently so now we all are to dismiss his success following hard work / good training / good driving / well graded horses on the improve which are subsequently well placed to acheive success and yet you would like us all to dismiss this on your 'smells a rat' theory? Please give us a break.

You were all self-righteous earlier stating that you weren't going to comment further yet you wailed straight back in the very next post. I think your credibility lacks when your soap-boxing about wanting justification from anyone regarding Luke's success, yet all you can do is cast disgraceful and baseless innuendo/aspersion following your 'smell a rat' theory!

[A BIT DUSTY]

ABD, please don't go all back pedal on us now. Your post #62 openly infers drug use / drug cheats when the topic you and I were bantering back and forth was L.McCarthy. At least have the gumption to stand by your inference.

You state nobody has a plausible explanation for McCarthy's success, yet you base your statements and inferences of him and his stables performance on the 'smells a rat' theory! Weak to say the least.


Currently - L.McCarthy - no positive swabs / no involvement in steward rorting and no charges for driving offences in recent memory, yet winning races consistently so now we all are to dismiss his success following hard work / good training / good driving / well graded horses on the improve which are subsequently well placed to acheive success and yet you would like us all to dismiss this on your 'smells a rat' theory? Please give us a break.

You were all self-righteous before stating that you weren't going to comment further yet you wailed straight back in the very next post. I think your credability lacks when your soap-boxing about wanting justification from anyone regarding Luke's success, yet all you can do is cast disgraceful and baseless innuendo following your 'smell a rat' theory!

Yep your right I must be all of those things Guilty as charged.
Shame on me for having those bad thoughts about an ANGEL . what was I thinking .
I'll have to stop forming opinions on what I have seen in my 53yrs and just run with the week and be silent.

[Old Frank]

Yep your right I must be all of those things Guilty as charged.
Shame on me for having those bad thoughts about an ANGEL . what was I thinking .
I'll have to stop forming opinions on what I have seen in my 53yrs and just run with the week and be silent.

Well ABD, opinions are what everyone's entitled too, but your version of opinion is casting aspersions / innuendo based on nothing but 'smells a rat' theory and is poor form in most people's assessement.

Shoe on the other foot, I suppose you'd love people in your circle of life casting versions of 'opinion' on you based on the thought you 'smelt like a rat' hey? I wouldn't have thought you would?

If McCarthy or anyone for that matter get's a positive, well they have to be answerable to that and yes, you'd be right there with the "I told you so", but as facts stands, you've got nothing. (Sorry ABD, 'smells a rat' probably just doesn't stand up to a positive charge!)

I hope as stated before Luke and his team have nothing but continued success. I think he's great for harness racing and good luck to him.

P.S: And please don't go sulking along with your 53yr comment trying to take some high ground 'know better/know all' perspective. Fact stands, your argument was flawed and baseless, nothing more, nothing less.

[mightymo]

You compare Luke to :

Ben Johnson - proven cheat
Marion Jones - proven cheat
Chinese swimmers - proven cheats

but you say you are not calling him a cheat... give me a break

In most jurisdictions and courts of law around the world, you are innocent until proven guilty, but in Dennys court you have to prove your innocence!!!

I suppose in your world, Usain Bolt, Michael Phelps, Ian Thorpe etc are all cheats...

[A BIT DUSTY]

Well ABD, opinions are what everyone's entitled too, but your version of opinion is casting aspersions / innuendo based on nothing but 'smells a rat' theory and is poor form in most people's assessement.

I suppose you'd love people casting your version of 'opinion' on you based on they thought you 'smelt like a rat' hey? I wouldn't have thought you would?

If McCarthy or anyone for that matter get's a positive, well they have to be answerable to that and yes, you'd be right there with the "I told you so", but as facts stands, you've got nothing. (Sorry ABD, 'smells a rat' probably just doesn't stand up to a positive charge!)

I hope as stated before Luke and his team have nothing but continued success. I think he's great for harness racing and good luck to him.

Nathan you stated you haven't read all of my post if you had you would have seen that I too have a high regard for Luke and would be only to happy to say My fears were unfounded.

Check out the thread ANYONE WANT TO GUESS #22 and you'll see that I have stated that on this forum.

Also if I was to show you some of my replies to the stack of private messages I have had on this issue ,you might appreciate that It is my greatest wish that all is above board ; but mate I get tired of the same old line that if you have suspicions you must be a jealous bigot as you elegantly put it.

HERE'S TO LUKE McCARTHY BEING PROVEN AS THE GREATEST HARNESS TRAINER IN HISTORY

AMEN

[A BIT DUSTY]

You compare Luke to :

Ben Johnson - proven cheat
Marion Jones - proven cheat
Chinese swimmers - proven cheats

but you say you are not calling him a cheat... give me a break

In most jurisdictions and courts of law around the world, you are innocent until proven guilty, but in Dennys court you have to prove your innocence!!!

I suppose in your world, Usain Bolt, Michael Phelps, Ian Thorpe etc are all cheats...

Nice to hear from you again Harvey I thought you had disappeared after your gaff about the Cordina security .
You appear to have missed the purpose of that inference .
I at no stage compared Luke to anyone, I told Old Frank that people where saying the same things about those people and they where later proven to be wrong.