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Thread: NSW 2yo Fillies racing opportunities. WHAT AN ABSOLUTE DISGRACE!!!!!!!!!!

  1. #1
    Senior Member Stallion Triple V will become famous soon enough Triple V's Avatar
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    Angry NSW 2yo Fillies racing opportunities. WHAT AN ABSOLUTE DISGRACE!!!!!!!!!!

    Here in NSW, between February 23rd and May 31st...exclusive of all Futurity, Sales and Classic events....there are a paltry 11 opportunities for bread & butter 2yo fillies...and that's most of them...to drop in and race against their own sex.
    By way of a direct comparison, and again exclusive of all Futurity, Sales & Classic events.......there are no fewer than 72 races carded where the fillies would have to face the colts & geldings. It's absolutely criminal. The owners of 2yo fillies just get hung out to dry year after year after year.

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    Senior Member Horse Of The Year broncobrad has a spectacular aura about
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    Jamie thats a fair few . And you have been banging this drum for a while now, and although we are reading it, the caretakers of the sport are not listening. The breeders are getting out, sales figures are through the floor and their is no confidence in the integrity of the sport on most levels. This is eyes painted on, ears blocked with wax type of management of a going concern. What are the industry leaders doing.

    You would think the grass roots of the Australian brand would be being nurtured. All they are doing is inviting the buyers to a NZ market.

    By the way, when did you become a super moderator, I remember one of your own posts in which you pretty well barred yourself from such a noble position.

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    Super Moderator Horse Of The Year teecee has a spectacular aura about teecee's Avatar
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    Just wondering...
    When one of these 2yo fillies only races is programmed how are they received by trainers?
    Are they ignored or ballot 2/3..3/4 of the entries????

  4. #4
    Banned Colt Old Frank will become famous soon enough
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    Jamie, this is one of my major gripes about NSW harness racing. Your point is in relation to 2yr old fillies but what about the disgraceful manner mares are treated in this state, outside of their 2 & 3yr old seasons (which as your highlighting is diabolical!)

    Don't anybody jump in and say how there's been a feature mares race for the last 3-4 metro's, take out the 6 week period around the Ladyship, leaving some 46 weeks where mares are uncatered for and fundamentally cannot earn any metro money as they have to race colts and geldings and cannot be competitive.

    There should be a 10 race program every metro meeting, 1 x trotters, 2 x mares, 7 x various grades and therefore you have room for all class of horse to be catered for consistently.

    There should be M0-M3 and M3+ for mares only every week and further, mares should automatically get a 1 grade 'lift' back when nominated for an open class race, i.e. an M2 mare automatically becomes an M1 and could actually race in an M0 with a junior. Therefore a mare has a chance to compile 4-5 metro wins next to her name, winning good prizemoney and helping her become commercially viable as a broodmare and her potential offspring. Or with mares only metro class, she can stay racing her own sex for maximum advantage.

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    Member Yearling Daryl New will become famous soon enough
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    The only part of this is the double drop back for mares. Im against double dipping. However why only mares ? what about all bread and butter horses, COs that have to compete against Derby contenders etc. Random barrier draws across multiple class conditions with also eligible clauses and the beauty of them all conditions of races being changed after acceptances etc.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Horse Of The Year mightymo will become famous soon enough
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Frank View Post
    Jamie, this is one of my major gripes about NSW harness racing. Your point is in relation to 2yr old fillies but what about the disgraceful manner mares are treated in this state, outside of their 2 & 3yr old seasons (which as your highlighting is diabolical!)

    Don't anybody jump in and say how there's been a feature mares race for the last 3-4 metro's, take out the 6 week period around the Ladyship, leaving some 46 weeks where mares are uncatered for and fundamentally cannot earn any metro money as they have to race colts and geldings and cannot be competitive.

    There should be a 10 race program every metro meeting, 1 x trotters, 2 x mares, 7 x various grades and therefore you have room for all class of horse to be catered for consistently.

    There should be M0-M3 and M3+ for mares only every week and further, mares should automatically get a 1 grade 'lift' back when nominated for an open class race, i.e. an M2 mare automatically becomes an M1 and could actually race in an M0 with a junior. Therefore a mare has a chance to compile 4-5 metro wins next to her name, winning good prizemoney and helping her become commercially viable as a broodmare and her potential offspring. Or with mares only metro class, she can stay racing her own sex for maximum advantage.
    agree 100%, although mares do get a reduction in class. ie an m2 mare can race in a M1 only race

  7. #7
    Senior Member Stallion Danno is a jewel in the rough
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple V View Post
    Here in NSW, between February 23rd and May 31st...exclusive of all Futurity, Sales and Classic events....there are a paltry 11 opportunities for bread & butter 2yo fillies...and that's most of them...to drop in and race against their own sex.
    By way of a direct comparison, and again exclusive of all Futurity, Sales & Classic events.......there are no fewer than 72 races carded where the fillies would have to face the colts & geldings. It's absolutely criminal. The owners of 2yo fillies just get hung out to dry year after year after year.
    Hey Jamie,
    what about we drop 2YO racing altogether, put that prizemoney into 3YO and 4YO racing and have a totally evenly divided prizemoney pool for the sexes!
    No 2YO racing would cut down on the accidental/inncidental wastage factor attached to juvenile racing and ensure a higher percentage of horses give a return to the owner. This coupled with more money available for fillies/ mares races and you might just help to increase the value of your yearlings due to the reduced wastage.

    Now I know this would be a massive step away from where we are now but, you know my opinion, I think we've been addicted to juvenile racing for far too long and I'm aware that I'll get lambasted from all and sundry for daring to suggest such a radical and initially expensive move, but one would hope people can take off the blinkers and give it a bit of thought.

    Heaps of babies get damaged mentally and physically during the process of TRYING to get to the races as 2YO's. If these strains were applied to the same horse with another 12 months of maturity you MUST get more "productivity" from the same group of horses.

    Righto, you can all start throwing shit at me now.
    Cheers,
    Dan

  8. #8
    Banned Yearling TSW will become famous soon enough
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple V View Post
    Here in NSW, between February 23rd and May 31st...exclusive of all Futurity, Sales and Classic events....there are a paltry 11 opportunities for bread & butter 2yo fillies...and that's most of them...to drop in and race against their own sex.
    By way of a direct comparison, and again exclusive of all Futurity, Sales & Classic events.......there are no fewer than 72 races carded where the fillies would have to face the colts & geldings. It's absolutely criminal. The owners of 2yo fillies just get hung out to dry year after year after year.
    May be a good way to protect the 2yo baby girls from over racing. When they've had a bit more time to grow and race well as 3yo+ you may think that it wasn't such a bad idea after all.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Horse Of The Year The Form Student will become famous soon enough
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple V View Post
    Here in NSW, between February 23rd and May 31st...exclusive of all Futurity, Sales and Classic events....there are a paltry 11 opportunities for bread & butter 2yo fillies...and that's most of them...to drop in and race against their own sex.
    By way of a direct comparison, and again exclusive of all Futurity, Sales & Classic events.......there are no fewer than 72 races carded where the fillies would have to face the colts & geldings. It's absolutely criminal. The owners of 2yo fillies just get hung out to dry year after year after year.
    Just a minute.........Racing adminstrators only have to look at the poor fields for 2YO fillies in the current Lynden Huntley Series to decide that fillies don't need more races..........5 colts & geldings heats (full fields) & 3 fillies heats with only 6-7 runners in each...........some lucky owner/trainer out of only 20 fillies is going to win a $50,000 prize...........pretty good odds to me...........maybe when some analysis is done of 2YO fillies nominations and they improve more race will be programmed.........probably a lot of trainers think that thay should just wait a bit longer with the fillies before racing them???

  10. #10
    Banned Colt Old Frank will become famous soon enough
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    Harvey and Daryl,

    Harvey - Is that the case in NSW? I know there is a 'lift/drop back' for mares in VIC but is it the case up here? You nominate and see race conditions a lot more so yes I could be wrong, a long time since I've read the race programming section of the Gazette or online!

    My sentiments for a 'lift/drop back' pertain to all mares, irrespective of the race. It could be a C6 mare dropping back and becoming eligible for a C4 race with junior.

    The industry needs mares winning, putting times down and winning good money in order to sustain the breeding industry which fundamentally is on it's knees.

    It doesn't matter that you might have a 'half sister' to this great mare, or whatever, if she only put's $20,000 next to her name (or worse), with really no performance, she won't, nor will her stock become commercially viable, and yes there would be the occassional exception to the rule however you know where I'm coming from.

    I have been involved with great stables in the past who had exceptional mares but they had too, and were subsquently burnt out by racing the boys week in-week out. They all got to the M3/M4/M5 class (did super jobs), but it was done over 100 races and were quite simply knackered at the end of it, hence I'm adamant that this effects their breeding capabilities (None have turned out a really good horse as yet)

    If you could retire a mare after her 4 or 5 yr old season with 50 starts next to her name and $50,000 - $100,000 dependant on her success, a.) you wouldn't have a tired mare who then your asking to carry a foal which is a heave in itself, but b.) your giving yourself and the breeding industry an injection of quality, measured performance and the buyers will rhave confidence in the product (yearling) being put forward and respond with purchase.

    You also have the ability by your mare winning good money to afford a bank to start breeding her properly and not face a black hole or bottomless pit of money awaiting trying to breed a mare who won nothing, yet your trying to aim to jag a $30,000 foal out of her, yeh good luck with that!

    Daryl,

    I'm sorry mate, but as awful as this sounds, I couldn't give a shit about C0 racing. If I was an industry leader and I was having to look at adjustments/clauses reconfiguration for C0 racing, fundamentally, I am rewarding mediocrity.

    They may be the 'bread and butter' as you put it and yes, I know the perspective your coming from, however all owners should, and in this case more importantly, administrators be aspiring to better the class and standard of metro racing as without successful metro class racing, you won't have a product to sell to the masses/TAB in the future. It's as simple as that.

    A vast majority of horses currently racing as C0's/C1's aren't worth two bob and in my opinion again, it's a disgrace that they get punched around lingering on the hope to their trainer and owners that they'll win a race - somewhere, anywhere.

    It costs the same to feed a bad one as it does a good one and to a large degree, the better the horse, the cheaper it is to train and you can give it less starts in better class races, thus racing for and earning better prizemoney, promoting satisfaction to all whilst the overall product is better.

    You don't see Bill Gates or the late Steve Jobs aspire to improve a class of the computer industry that everyone has done/is doing, keeping the 'bread and butter' happy, they implement product that betters the overall industry, time and again, taking their innovation and quality of product higher and higher, thus the marketplace is drawn to their success and their industries power ahead constantly.

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