2yo Fillies in NSW. The saga continues.

[Lethal]

You don't seem to get it.
If you want all NSW 2yolds to race at Menangle whenever the Club wish to programme races to suit them and the TAB then the answer is simple!
Make the experience at the least revenue neutral by subsidising heavy float rebates, similar to Penrith a few years ago, where it was calculated on a radius from the track.
Let's just think for a minute.
If you can win a trial at,say, Maitland, but not run time, why would you then be prepared to outlay huge costs just TO MAKE UP NUMBERS.
Being able to place a horse in a suitable race that, at the worst you can run a tote, surely shows that your first priority is your owner, not the club nor the TAB even more with 2yo.

[Triple V]

Jamie,
there's a thing called EMPATHY,if there was a book on it that i could refer you to I'd be very pleased to do that but I learnt empathy from my parents and as such, being a "baby boomer" trusted what I was taught by my elders rather than challenging the same and then expecting to see a nationally funded multi faceted research programme designed primarily to default said information on empathy so as to further challenge anything my parents or any other moronic person may have uttered so I could "make up my own mind".

I'm certain you can find some information on the internet about empathy, but I'm uncertain if the translation on the net will actually mean anything to you.
Cheers,
Dan

[VVV] G'day Dan,
When I read that it immediately translates to 'touchy feely speak' for... geeze, it looks like it's going to be pretty hard to make some changes that will ultimately be for the greater good so instead of inconveniencing some people along the way how about we just sit on our hands do nothing?
You and I and the proverbial gatepost knows that the current situation is periodically dysfunctional and in the longer term, completely untenable. There has to be a better way.
Btw Dan, on the subject of empathy...I mentioned in a reply to you that I am certain the fix is in as far as who will get what of the proposed on-course stabling at the various regional centres & that the smaller stables and 1-2 horse trainers are going to meet with a shut out as sure as the sun rises in the East and sets in the West.
In response, for someone with so much concern for the well-being of your fellow participants, not so much as a word ? That's an example of a pressing issue, one that is at least as important if not moreso right now than the 2yo fillies thing and one that, as I said before, desperately needs clubbing to death before it grows wings and flies...and still, not a word? If I didn't give a toss about others, would I bother highlighting the on-course stabling issue and in doing so get myself offside with the driving force/s behind that plan? Give me a break.
There's the right thing to do, the wrong thing to do & then there's what I understand to be that which various Industry administrative persons have in mind, which is an unfortunate mixture of both. Sitting back and doing nothing is exactly what they're banking on participants doing because that bolsters their case for change, much of which may not be palatable to yourself and many others. It's better to become part of the discussion early and as much as possible steer it in the right or best direction possible. Otherwise it will all be thrust upon you, the good, the bad and the ugly aspects.

[Triple V]

You don't seem to get it.
If you want all NSW 2yolds to race at Menangle whenever the Club wish to programme races to suit them and the TAB then the answer is simple!
Make the experience at the least revenue neutral by subsidising heavy float rebates, similar to Penrith a few years ago, where it was calculated on a radius from the track.
Let's just think for a minute.
If you can win a trial at,say, Maitland, but not run time, why would you then be prepared to outlay huge costs just TO MAKE UP NUMBERS.
Being able to place a horse in a suitable race that, at the worst you can run a tote, surely shows that your first priority is your owner, not the club nor the TAB even more with 2yo.

[VVV] G'day Lee,
It's exactly those preconceived notions that sees the Industry with feet of clay whenever handicapping and programming issues are raised. This thread and previous versions thereof is about/has been about the lack of 2yo Fillies Only racing opportunities in NSW. I don't care where they get to race just so long as they get to race their own sex somewhere, for reasonable $ and on a regular basis. For the particular race in question there were TWO (2) nominations Lee. The others would indeed have been making up the numbers but ONLY insofar as that race going ahead. The Menangle race is in question here for the simple reason that in much the same fashion as they did with the Trotters ranks not many years ago, the NSWHRC has agreed to seek/has sought an undertaking/dispensation from HRNSW in order to go ahead with 2yo Fillies Only races where a minimum of six (6) nominations are received (note...nominations, not final acceptances), this in order to do their bit and be seen to be doing their bit to foster/bolster the ranks of a largely neglected division and also as a longer term service to the Breeding Industry in this State. Part of the thinking there also being that ultimately a good % of those raced & hopefully winning fillies will become NSW based broodmares which will in turn bolster the horse numbers in this State...and around and around it goes.
Dot raised the subject of a Heats & Finals approach and in terms of supporting the Country based fillies and encouraging them to come to Menangle & I can't see any reason why the 2yo fillies couldn't be part of the program set down for Heats & Finals for the C0's-1's-2's-3's etc which is aimed at encouraging them to do the same. Postcode the noms by all means, make sure they're trained from a Country base for the 28 days prior or whatever and fire away. If that's what it takes, go for gold. I don't care how it gets done but it needs to get done and it needs to get done yesterday.

[Triple V]

This coming Friday night (11th May) @ Menangle.

1 Mile, 2yo PBD/2C/PBDS for 22k, non winners of a race more than $12,000 this season.
4 nominations. Race duly scrapped.

1 Mile, 3yo PBD/3C Fillies Only for 22k, non winners of a race more than $12,000 this season. 7 straight noms + 1 also eng. Penrith. Race just scrapes by for the go ahead.

What do they need to nom for these races? Dancing Girls scattering Rose Petals at their feet as they walk? Fair dinkum.

[Danno]

[QUOTE]

[VVV] G'day Dan,
When I read that it immediately translates to 'touchy feely speak' for... geeze, it looks like it's going to be pretty hard to make some changes that will ultimately be for the greater good so instead of inconveniencing some people along the way how about we just sit on our hands do nothing?

Jamie,
can I respectfully suggest you consult your dictionary for "empathy", on this particular thread people have been trying to get you to see the position of others who may or may not choose to nominate their 2yo fillies to, apparently no avail.

[Triple V]

G'day Dan,
In the big scheme of things empathy or that which you obviously see as lackthereof is probably not what you should be worried about.
Apathy is and has always been the Industry's biggest enemy and it will be very soon once again used against us.
For instance, in the not too distant future it's evens into tomato sauce there will be some Trainers, especially small team, part-time & country based ones, who scream long and loud when Centralised Programming is finally introduced here in NSW and they're left with a choice to either go racing wherever the events for their horses are programmed during that week...or otherwise have their horse/s stay at home in the barn until one closer to home comes along.
They'll once again scream long and loud and rightly so AFTER the shut out of on-course training/stabling becomes apparent by way of bigger local, interstate and trans Tasman operations monopolising all of the available space.
Both these things are real issues and both already in train and as sure as night follows day both of them WILL happen, it is only a matter of time.
Centralised Programming is one that I happen to agree with, I'm looking forward to it especially so from the perspective of fillies & mares racing, because I think it will ultimately benefit the majority of the Industry...however I am also aware that there'll be some that it will not suit and there will be some who will down right despise it.
The expected on course stabling shut out, of course I absolutely abhore the very real prospect of that happening...however you watch & wait.
As per usual nobody with any sort of a stake in it and especially so an opposing view will do a damned thing until it is all over bar the shouting and they're in a position where they can't do a damned thing to change it.
The smoke and mirrors and slight of hand that has become attached to the subject of on-course training/stabling in particular...it has got to be seen and heard to be believed. So then, I've lifted the sheet of corrugated iron up on that one...who's going to be there to stomp on the greeblies as they try to run away?

[dizzy]

A small correction for you Jamie-I did suggest heat and finals for 2yo fillies in the country but I did not ,or did not intend to, suggest that the finals should be held at menangle

[Lethal]

There you go again. I'm wondering if you are just trying to wind everyone up?
Forcing trainers to travel ANYWHERE in NSW.! Who do think pays? THE OWNERS. It is plainly obvious that you are NOT one these rare breeds, because if you were you would be horrified at the TRUE cost of floating to racetracks outside your domicile, especially if you only take one (2yo for instance who often need a travelling companion, thereby increasing cost).
It won't be the trainers screaming, it will be the owners after receiving their last account. The trainers will scream later, after the owner switches their horse to a BIG BARN trainer, having done all the early work with the horse.
I'm not sure why you think big barn training is the be all. Maybe you are not aware of the large number of well bred but underperformed and chronically lame horses, that historically were switched to trainers with outside boxes and paddocks that literally grew another leg.
Why would you want to go big barn when gallops trainers are spending huge amounts to exit big barns and set up farms to replicate paddock training. It's a step backwards as has already been proven by winners of VIC. metro/country NSW.metro/country HR premierships.

[Triple V]

Hey Lee, if you try to cram any more words into my mouth I will be a fair chance to choke. Add that to the shoot the old messenger routine & you're two for two. Can you point to so much as a single instance of me saying that I thought big barn training is the be all, end all? Where on Earth did that one come from? No me. Never, ever said that, not even hinted at it. Don't believe it to be true in all instances, never have.
Rather, I've repeatedly pointed out that unless small numbers, part-time and country based Trainers who want to secure space in on-course training/stabling facilities get off their cans and let it be known that not only do they want space to be made available for them but they expect space to be made available for them....then the big barns routine will be left to rule the waves. Any chance you could haul yourself back from that flight of fancy above? If you had the chance would you like to train/stable one or two on-course at one of the proposed regional centres or at Menangle?

[Triple V]

A small correction for you Jamie-I did suggest heat and finals for 2yo fillies in the country but I did not ,or did not intend to, suggest that the finals should be held at menangle

[VVV] The $$$ could be made worthwhile for a Country Heats/Menangle Finals scenario. Where else do you expect the requisite kanga to come from Dot? and by kanga I'm talking 8k-10k country venue Heats leading into 20k-25k Finals or something in that range.
Let's be a bit realistic. What other Club in NSW is presently in a position to be able to pony up those kinds of dollars? The wiggle room's diminishing rapidly huh? Post Code conditions to keep Metro based horses out, good $$$ on offer for a series of Country Heats culimating in a very good $$$ Menangle Final so the travel would be worth it, same Heat/Final for a single penalty scenario they're using for the C0's-1's-2's-3's etc.
Ahhhh...how remiss of me. Jupiter won't be aligned with Mars anytime soon huh? Bugger...you know, for a moment there I thought we almost had it across the line.
Btw, Wally and Dewsbury told me to tell you to stop using their hoof dressing.