Raceday Medications USA

[dizzy]

VVV, Bill seems as if you were wrong on the publics opinion of therapeutic drugs in racing, and that opinion's ability to have things change.

On the 19th of July more then 40 of North America's most prominent thoroughbred owners announced they had signed a pledge to ban Lasix from being used on their 2yo's in 2012. If you know the permisive attitude to raceday medication in the US then you'll know how big a step this is, and it came about because of the publics attitude to the use of drugs in racing.

The details can be found here. www.cleanhorseracing.org
click on "supporters" to view the opinions of hall of fame trainer D Wayne Lucas and others on the effects of using legal therapeutic medications in racing.

VVV you have advocated the use of therapeutic medications in order to better look after the horses from the demands of racing and help them recover. The North American experience has been that it didn't work that way. But you may get the makings of your list as one of the proposals is a list of 25 permissable therapeutics only (and not on raceday) with withdrawal times.


The debate on this has been raging for the last 12 months or so over there, and in March the New York times ran a 4 part story on racing. In many states lasix,anabolic steroids, corticosteroids, bute and other anti inflamatories/painkillers have been legal on raceday but it is changing. I cant put up a link but if you google "mangled horses and maimed jockeys" you will find it. It contains a video as well and as a word of warning the images are graphic. Also bear in mind the fatality statistics do not include those horse who are "vanned" of the track and subsequently euthanised at a clinic or farm.

This is not harness racing but TB racing so some of you will say what has this got to do with us? Harness racing is conducted under the same medication rules as TB racing. Of course we don't look as bad as the TB's /quarter horses, we don't race in New Mexico for a start, and we do have a sounder breed but for how long?

The legends of harness racing such as Meadow Skipper, Bret Hanover, Albatross, Cam Fella all had lengthy racing careers in an era of heat and final racing on the same day and before race day meds were common. I'll leave you to make your own comparisons with the stallions of today. I think the LBJ is about the only same day heat and final race left.

If someone wants a more detailed read then I recommend this
www.horsefund.org/the-chemical-horse-part-1.php

It is on a horse welfare site but is not at all "lunatic fringe" but well researched and referenced with stats from industry studies and quotes from many respected participants. It is lengthy so allow some time but it comes in parts so is not difficult to read.

[Thevoiceofreason]

VVV, Bill seems as if you were wrong on the publics opinion of therapeutic drugs in racing, and that opinion's ability to have things change.

On the 19th of July more then 40 of North America's most prominent thoroughbred owners announced they had signed a pledge to ban Lasix from being used on their 2yo's in 2012. If you know the permisive attitude to raceday medication in the US then you'll know how big a step this is, and it came about because of the publics attitude to the use of drugs in racing.

The details can be found here. www.cleanhorseracing.org
click on "supporters" to view the opinions of hall of fame trainer D Wayne Lucas and others on the effects of using legal therapeutic medications in racing.

VVV you have advocated the use of therapeutic medications in order to better look after the horses from the demands of racing and help them recover. The North American experience has been that it didn't work that way. But you may get the makings of your list as one of the proposals is a list of 25 permissable therapeutics only (and not on raceday) with withdrawal times.


The debate on this has been raging for the last 12 months or so over there, and in March the New York times ran a 4 part story on racing. In many states lasix,anabolic steroids, corticosteroids, bute and other anti inflamatories/painkillers have been legal on raceday but it is changing. I cant put up a link but if you google "mangled horses and maimed jockeys" you will find it. It contains a video as well and as a word of warning the images are graphic. Also bear in mind the fatality statistics do not include those horse who are "vanned" of the track and subsequently euthanised at a clinic or farm.

This is not harness racing but TB racing so some of you will say what has this got to do with us? Harness racing is conducted under the same medication rules as TB racing. Of course we don't look as bad as the TB's /quarter horses, we don't race in New Mexico for a start, and we do have a sounder breed but for how long?

The legends of harness racing such as Meadow Skipper, Bret Hanover, Albatross, Cam Fella all had lengthy racing careers in an era of heat and final racing on the same day and before race day meds were common. I'll leave you to make your own comparisons with the stallions of today. I think the LBJ is about the only same day heat and final race left.

If someone wants a more detailed read then I recommend this
www.horsefund.org/the-chemical-horse-part-1.php

It is on a horse welfare site but is not at all "lunatic fringe" but well researched and referenced with stats from industry studies and quotes from many respected participants. It is lengthy so allow some time but it comes in parts so is not difficult to read.

Dot

I am not sure what planet you are on but I have never ever suggested Lasix as an accepted race day medication or even as an acceptable medication for EIPH.

In relation to this story in reality it is actually agreeing with what VVV has been saying, accepted therapeutic substances with withholding periods so that metabolites in the urine is not enough for a positive swab.

The drama is the USA system does not work neither does the Aussie one the answer lies somewhere in the middle.

[Triple V]

VVV, Bill seems as if you were wrong on the publics opinion of therapeutic drugs in racing, and that opinion's ability to have things change.

On the 19th of July more then 40 of North America's most prominent thoroughbred owners announced they had signed a pledge to ban Lasix from being used on their 2yo's in 2012. If you know the permisive attitude to raceday medication in the US then you'll know how big a step this is, and it came about because of the publics attitude to the use of drugs in racing.

The details can be found here. www.cleanhorseracing.org
click on "supporters" to view the opinions of hall of fame trainer D Wayne Lucas and others on the effects of using legal therapeutic medications in racing.

VVV you have advocated the use of therapeutic medications in order to better look after the horses from the demands of racing and help them recover. The North American experience has been that it didn't work that way. But you may get the makings of your list as one of the proposals is a list of 25 permissable therapeutics only (and not on raceday) with withdrawal times.


The debate on this has been raging for the last 12 months or so over there, and in March the New York times ran a 4 part story on racing. In many states lasix,anabolic steroids, corticosteroids, bute and other anti inflamatories/painkillers have been legal on raceday but it is changing. I cant put up a link but if you google "mangled horses and maimed jockeys" you will find it. It contains a video as well and as a word of warning the images are graphic. Also bear in mind the fatality statistics do not include those horse who are "vanned" of the track and subsequently euthanised at a clinic or farm.

This is not harness racing but TB racing so some of you will say what has this got to do with us? Harness racing is conducted under the same medication rules as TB racing. Of course we don't look as bad as the TB's /quarter horses, we don't race in New Mexico for a start, and we do have a sounder breed but for how long?

The legends of harness racing such as Meadow Skipper, Bret Hanover, Albatross, Cam Fella all had lengthy racing careers in an era of heat and final racing on the same day and before race day meds were common. I'll leave you to make your own comparisons with the stallions of today. I think the LBJ is about the only same day heat and final race left.

If someone wants a more detailed read then I recommend this
www.horsefund.org/the-chemical-horse-part-1.php

It is on a horse welfare site but is not at all "lunatic fringe" but well researched and referenced with stats from industry studies and quotes from many respected participants. It is lengthy so allow some time but it comes in parts so is not difficult to read.

[VVV] Comprehension 101 there Dot. You've read it but because of a prior held view akin to a Limpet on a rock and so a pre-determined spin on the thrust of that piece, your summation/synopsis is so far off the runway as to have landed in the native plant regeneration area.
Go read it over again. That story is COMPLETELY in line with what I've been saying all along. VOR has raised a point ages ago that in his opinion EIPH is the single biggest animal welfare issue the Industry faces and that there are better anti-bleeder meds around than Lasix, two points with which I completely agree. To my knowledge nobody on this Forum has raised the need for a US style pre race Lasix program to be introduced here in Oz, not VOR nor me (and if I have done so then I was wrong)... and nor anyone else as far as I can recall but please, by all means, don't let that stand in the way of a good story.
Interestingly one of those much better anti-bleeder options around that VOR speaks of is the substance that Geoff Small was jammed up for, Amicar or versions thereof.

Incidentally Dot, you've invoked the names of some of the greats of the Breed there, Meadow Skipper, Bret Hanover, Albatross & Cam Fella to buttress your point by way of.... QUOTE [The legends of harness racing such as Meadow Skipper, Bret Hanover, Albatross, Cam Fella all had lengthy racing careers in an era of heat and final racing on the same day and before race day meds were common. I'll leave you to make your own comparisons with the stallions of today. I think the LBJ is about the only same day heat and final race left.]

Lengthy careers? Comparisons with the stallions of today? You need to do your homework Dot.
Insofar as the length of their respective race careers go...
Meadow Skipper had 86 starts lifetime incl. 27 as a 2yo and retired as a 3yo with a mark of 1:55.1.
Albatross had 71 starts lifetime and retired as a 4yo with a mark of 1:54.3
Bret Hanover had 68 starts lifetime and retired as a 4yo with a TT mark of 1:53.3
Cam Fella had 80 starts lifetime and retired as a 4yo with a mark of 1:53.1.

The 'before race day meds were common' piece makes me chuckle Dot, seriously.
That's one of the best 'passing of time serving to glorify history' efforts I've read in a long, long time.
Race day meds have been going around since back before Hannibal used to drench his War Elephants with a mixture of hot Mullberry juice & assorted goodies in order to encourage them to punch-on.
Rumours abounded for years that Billy Direct raced on Heroin and back then it was quite commonplace for horses to be drenched with Laudnum. It was often referred to as Texas Tea. I can remember certain people doing that here in Australia back when I was only a small child. They'd tube them on-course.
The late Laurie Moulds was a specialist at it. He had a Catholic Priest who used to act as his lookout. So please, let's not make out as though racing was somehow so much purer back then and the horses so much better and more noble then than they are now because that is simply delusional.

Additional. One of today's stallions, Rock N Roll Heaven, went 2 Heats to win the Jug and tossed down a pair of World Record 1:49.4 miles on a half mile track. Not bad.

[racefair]

EIPH can be a big problem. I think that some Aussie trainers have treatments for it which has been evidenced by known "bleeders" coming from the United States and competing here like Mr Feelgood.
“Australian medication rules are far more stringent than in North America. That includes no Lasix which Mr Feelgood had raced with since January 1 of last
year.” – Article published in March 2009 http://www.theharnessedge.com/pdf-co...er_HE_0309.pdf

[Lethal]

"What has happened in the downward spiral of horse racing in North America is that drugs inappropriately classified as therapeutic have superseded what once was accepted practice, and now substitute in great quantity what other more dangerous drugs accomplished in lesser concentration. Why? Because these are the accepted rules, and punishment is typically inconsequential. Play by the rules and reap the benefits with minor expenditure and penalty. The innocuous Class 4 drugs function most conveniently, as tokens of blamelessness."

This is quote from the site in America mentioned by Dot. If any fair minded person in Harness Racing were to think this is the right way, then our sport has noway to head but down, needlessly just like them

[Triple V]

Hey Lee, for the benefit of inquiring minds that would really like to know about such things, could you please list all the drugs that have, in your opinion, been inappropriately classified as therapeutics in the US/CAN?

Having listed them could you then please offer a reason or reasons as to why they are not in fact therapeutic substances?

I look forward to your reply.

[Thevoiceofreason]

Dot

When I first started in racing stables in the early seventies bute was able to be used up until three days before the race and not produce a positive swab, any tranier winning races was using anabolics.

Whilst I was not around Phar Lap died of arsenic poisoning, if you believe that anybody other the trainer was giving him arsenic then you are living on another planet, do not act like drug use on horses is something new.

[Lethal]

Hey Lee, for the benefit of inquiring minds that would really like to know about such things, could you please list all the drugs that have, in your opinion, been inappropriately classified as therapeutics in the US/CAN?

Having listed them could you then please offer a reason or reasons as to why they are not in fact therapeutic substances?

I look forward to your reply.

Jaimie,
When Cleopatra was told Antony had married another woman, her response was that she saw the storytellers eyes as 'Balls' (you know them, the ones Dot wanted). The response from him was *roughly translated as* 'DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER'

[Triple V]

Lee, you made the following statement.

What has happened in the downward spiral of horse racing in North America is that drugs inappropriately classified as therapeutic have superseded what once was accepted practice, and now substitute in great quantity what other more dangerous drugs accomplished in lesser concentration. Why? Because these are the accepted rules, and punishment is typically inconsequential. Play by the rules and reap the benefits with minor expenditure and penalty. The innocuous Class 4 drugs function most conveniently, as tokens of blamelessness.
This is quote from the site in America mentioned by Dot. If any fair minded person in Harness Racing were to think this is the right way, then our sport has noway to head but down, needlessly just like them

...and I'm simply asking you to qualify that statement by naming some or all of the drugs that were/have been/are, in your opinion, inappropriately classified as therapeutic. Call it a fleshing out of your agument if you like. So, what are the names of these inappropriately classified substances?

[Lethal]

Jaimie,
When Cleopatra was told Antony had married another woman, her response was that she saw the storytellers eyes as 'Balls' (you know them, the ones Dot wanted). The response from him was *roughly translated as* 'DON'T SHOOT THE MESSENGER'

Jaimie,
Read the post...............It's a quote...........self explanatory.....NO?