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Thread: thornyyyyyy

  1. #71
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    I am sorry if this has already been covered or if it offends anyone but People like thorn and Kennedy are turning this sport into a joke! I have noted that throughout the conversation The fact that thorn and others are not using any substances or not has been debated. At this stage because in Australia you are innocent until proven guilty they are innocent due to the absence of any positive swabs.
    However, The way that these trainers can magically improve horses lengths in very short periods (less than a week) is simply not possible! In a one week period you have the opportunity to work the horse on one or two occasions where a few gear adjustments and the like can be made. This in rare cases, can make a large and quick improvement in a horses performance, but certainly doesn't occur with every horse as is the case with these trainers!
    One trainer I have noted of late who seemed to have this miraculous ability for the last 2 or 3 years was David druitt in the riverina area. This ability suddenly appeared out of nowhere after 15 years of struggling to get a horse to keep up! He, much like many of the suspected trainers in the game, was constantly taking very weak and poorly performed horses and getting them to run in the death seat doing enormous amounts of work and still winning convincingly! I have noted after a spate of blood testing in the area 6 months ago his team has reverted to the previous 15 years and is barely able to keep up once again.
    Their ability to improve on all trainers also astounds me. In today's game anyone who trains horses for a living does it pretty well and there is not much improvement possible on the way the horse is trained. Once again there is a rare occasion where trainers can be improved on.
    The strike rate of these stables is also exemplary! I would guess that the winning percentage of these stables would be from 40-50% which simply isn't possible without some help! This of course doesn't take into account hobby trainers who may only have one or two horses in work and only start them rarely. Of any of the large stables the best of their strike rates would be maybe 10-15%. This is a very large difference!
    I noted also earlier there was a discussion about horses being back in grade at menangle and them being able to take advantage of the bigger track. In regards to this point I would like to bring a case forward. Dartmoor had been racing in QLD struggling to win claiming races. It arrives in Sydney steps straight into metro or handicap class races and wins 3 or 4 races straight all in dominate fashion. This appears to me as a step up in grade!
    Also thorn has just last week trained 4 winners at menangle on Friday night at a metropolitan class meeting. I can hardly remember him training more than 4 winners at metro meetings in a year! This could be a result of him being sent some better class horses and he maybe just having a purple patch which can happen but he has constantly been winning trebles of late which is almost impossible to do with a team of around 15-16 horses. This has been happening in the riverina with the Kennedy stable who work a few more horses numbers wise and admittedly they have some very talented ones, but they train a treble or more every week! This isn't possible!
    It is also very coincidental how the stewards arrived at the stables of thorn the horses that night did not show their usually qualities. Another cases of this was with the Russo stable when they were followed to the wagga pacers cup meeting. They had two horses engaged in the event one being doctor zeus and the other being a claiming class horse! Both of these had good form prior and were well fancied. They both however performed very poorly and dropped out at the 400.
    I have tried to write a reply that presents the facts and my opinion all at once which can be difficult to do. I also do not mean to aim this article at any particular stables, however the ones mentioned are just the most blatant examples of this in racing at the current time.

  2. #72
    Junior Member Foal allthingsharness will become famous soon enough
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    Jackson Grant jealousy is a curse. Seven or eight paragraphs of claims and not one bit of evidence!

    Lets have a look at his performances when the stewards turned up!

    26th Feb:
    Mister Anthony sat parked and was beaten 1.6 metres - not a bad effort!
    Vertigal got smashed up the back and then had to go to early and still came in third.

    So the stewards roll up for another peek on the 5th March
    Indy Village led, won - 1:53:5
    Vertigal 3rd and all reports it come close to breaking a last half record over 2300m
    Perfect shot - 2nd running 1:52:8 and running home in a 26.8 qtr
    Bo Sparta 3rd

    Jackson Grant you have to be joking!!!

    All I can say is let stewards keeping rolling up to his place and the swabs pre and post race continue and then the winners continue!
    Sad thing is that you will still be complaining in 12 months time!

    I suggest Jackson Grant, you go find yourself some horses with some real upside and send them to a real trainer and enjoy some of the prize money increases coming our way!

  3. #73
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    Megasam NZ,
    You have got to be kidding! Accusing me of being over the top and then calling thorn "the menangle king!"
    I have warmed to the idea that some people can train, however I don't believe overnight they can go from being like thorn was to not being beaten!
    My comments are from my point of view as a trainer and driver! I could not count the amount of times that I have finished 2nd in a race to a horse that is from one of these stables and to be honest it gives me the shits! It has cost me and the owners of the horses thousands and thosands of dollars!

    However, from the point of view that you are coming from (degenerate gambler) I would love these stables! Just by following them you can make a fortune!!
    Regards Jackson Grant!

  4. #74
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    Allthingsharness,
    If thorn is doing it without using anything good on him! He deserves to win races! I however have had enough experience in this game to realize to do what he is doing is simply not possible!

    Let the stewards continue to go to his place and the winners keep coming! Haha those two things will not happen at the same time!

  5. #75
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    And as for being a real trainer, how many of these horses has thorn had since they were yearlings?! How many has he done all the hard work with of breaking them in and getting them to run!!

    All these stables do is get old horses who have some ability treat them and take them to the races! That is not a real trainer!!

  6. #76
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    Sam NZ! I think it's closer to my last 130 starts!

  7. #77
    Junior Member Weanling Camber on the bend will become famous soon enough
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    First time poster on here but no one seems to ask the question so I might as well.

    If all these stables are using something and are getting swabbed all the time, then how come they aren't getting any positives?

    I would have thought that if they were using something then surely the swabs would come back positive.

  8. #78
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    I agree with megasam NZ on that. Apparently it is very expensive to test all of these samples. Even when pre race blood samples are taken generally they are only tested for TCO2, when they are taken from our horses that is the case anyway...
    People say that the USA is 10 years ahead of our swabbing procedures so it is not hard to see how they cannot pick up every substance.

  9. #79
    Junior Member Weanling Camber on the bend will become famous soon enough
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    Megasam no it is the camber on the old cherry capitals bends. There isnt any.

    Back to the topic. So you are saying that they do not test for everything. What is everything? With this I mean that surely in this day and age their swabbing procedure covers all the illegal substances right?

    Jackson Grant who do you have horses with?

    What I would like to know is how do the trainers know what substances the Stewards are swabbing for. Also how do the trainers know which samples and swabs will be fully tested?

    I believe they dont so I cannot see in anyones right mind why you would want to use illegal substances when you simply do not know what is tested for and when.

    Did that make sense?

  10. #80
    Junior Member Weanling Jackson Grant will become famous soon enough
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    When they take blood from horses there is a slip that has boxes ticked that show what it is to be tested for. On this list there is about 10 substances. The only one I've ever seen ticked when they have taken blood is TCO2. I don't know if this is always the case it's just what I've noticed... I dont really know if this is all try test for or not.

    The trainers don't or shouldn't know who, when or what they are being tested for so it really is a risk that they take when using these substances for the first time especially.

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