Shepparton Gold Cup

[aussiebreno]

http://media.harness.org.au/vic/BNC12121307.mp4

For benefit of Broncobrad. Watch Giacomo in the yellow from four one the front line. He went just as far if not further than Gold Ace before going sketchy for a couple strides. He was made ODS. Hope that clears up the at start/after start for you.

[Smoken]

I lied, I can't stop
Everything about this is just plain wrong! It's doing my head in that some people can't see this!
Scrap the rule book, and replace it with a book of Circus Clowns!
I have seen that replay over 40 times, and my opinion is exactly what I stated!
I am glad Paul saw what I saw for the last 40 times
Just saw that replay brenno posted. Gee **** wiz!!

[p plater]

From the Victorian rule book.

8.2.2
In a standing start
-
not delay the start through intractability and leave the
barrier at the correct gait then complete the trial in a competitive manner
without losing gait or rhythm.

[broncobrad]

http://media.harness.org.au/vic/BNC12121307.mp4

For benefit of Broncobrad. Watch Giacomo in the yellow from four one the front line. He went just as far if not further than Gold Ace before going sketchy for a couple strides. He was made ODS. Hope that clears up the at start/after start for you.

Brendan, I have already said I can offer no reason why the horse is still ODS, please ask HRV or Luke. They will have the answer, not me.


Your example to clear up the at start/after start only muddies the waters. Giacomo skipped of his own accord, he didn't have a horse parked in front to cause the driver to take evasive action as TGA had to. The stewards report that he 'broke after start' but as you say he was made ODS (as were about 150 horses in that race).


It is a matter of opinion/conjecture as to why TGA galloped, it is plain as day that Giacomo broke without another horse interfering with him.


Smoken, you are a big fibber lol

[aussiebreno]

Why oh why am I continuing to be part of this debate is beyond me...however, if an animal has fulfilled the conditions as required to, what more does the horse have to do? Solemnly swear with hoof on bible that "I will do everything within my power to make sure I do not skip, jump, fart or gallop when the tapes release. If I do step away as required then I will, to avoid any embarrassment to my driver, ensure I drive straight up the back of the horse in front of me, even when it is taking my rightful running. I will do my damnedness not to break into a full stretched gallop if my driver takes the common sense approach of avoiding aforementioned horse"


The horse has got a list of convictions a mile long. The horse didn't write the conditions that had to be fulfilled, HRV did. Take it up with them. THEIR STEWARDS DEEMED THE HORSE GALLOPED AFTER THE START, NOT AT THE START. This isn't a court of inquiry here, its a bunch of opinions being expressed earnestly by forum contributors, nothing more. Going over the same territory doesn't change what has occurred. Anyone here seen the camera angle down the back at the start of the Shep Cup? Doubt it, nor have I? I will take the word of the Chief Steward.


Now when the conditions of the Cup were drawn up back in 2007, the committee was doing the right thing in protecting the interests of other starters...they put the Clauses in it that still apply today. Let them review the conditions AFTER this cup if they deem it needs to be changed, because obviously there are a shitload of people who think it should be.


Smoken, if that is what Lance said so be it, but it wasn't HRVs fault his champ wasn't left out of the cup last year...and I was one that thought he should have been there, but his horse had not met the criteria. Tough potatoes!


Finally horses are not machines, they are not foolproof or bombproof or can offer no guarantees. They surely cannot be penalised for doing something they may or may not do in the future. There is an existing system in place that deals with actualities. Its called "back to the trials" And BTW, can anyone tell me the last time they saw SmokenUp break into a full gallop?

Brendan, I have already said I can offer no reason why the horse is still ODS, please ask HRV or Luke. They will have the answer, not me.


Your example to clear up the at start/after start only muddies the waters. Giacomo skipped of his own accord, he didn't have a horse parked in front to cause the driver to take evasive action as TGA had to. The stewards report that he 'broke after start' but as you say he was made ODS (as were about 150 horses in that race).


It is a matter of opinion/conjecture as to why TGA galloped, it is plain as day that Giacomo broke without another horse interfering with him.


Smoken, you are a big fibber lol

Forgetting The Gold Ace for a second, the only point I was trying to clarify was what is at the start / after the start for you. 50m down the track is still considered part of the start (even if BAS stands for Broke after start) as that is considered part of the start. If they break in home straight you will notice they only say broke...not Broke after start even though technically it is.

[The Escape Club]

I lied, I can't stop
Everything about this is just plain wrong! It's doing my head in that some people can't see this!
Scrap the rule book, and replace it with a book of Circus Clowns!
I have seen that replay over 40 times, and my opinion is exactly what I stated!
I am glad Paul saw what I saw for the last 40 times
Just saw that replay brenno posted. Gee **** wiz!!

How many of those 40 times was it the head on vision that you've watched?

[Smoken]

I can't lie and say I have seen head on, but I don't need to lie, as it's clear as day to see that as Paul said, Luke had an option to what to do, and if you were to look at the replay as many times as I have, if you're honest, you will admit that the interference was extremely minimal if any at all caused to TGA!
He simply galloped out because he started to quickly, and as I said, his galloping was at the same speed if not quicker, & Luke did absolutely nothing to try bring him back into a pace!
That ground he made up was unfair, look at it again and judge for yourself.

I agree Brad, I am a fibber, but not on this occasion