Stewards Info NSW

[doinmabest]

The following directions and resolutions emanated from the HRNSW Board Meeting yesterday, effective immediately.

1. Stewards intend to be more stringent and fine drivers for talking while on the racetrack in association with the Australian Harness Racing Rules

2. Stewards intend to be more stringent and fine drivers for contacting marker pegs in association the Australian Harness Racing Rules

3. Following intensive research HRNSW has expanded its strategy with regards to freezing swab samples in the expectation that testing protocols for a number of substances, including ITPP, is imminent

[triplev123]

Welcome to everyone's favourite Game Show

RULE....OF....THE....WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!

Now here's your host....Damon Killian!
http://dvdtalk.com/reviews/images/reviews/76/1078446216.jpg
WHO DO YOU LOVE? WHO...DO....YOU LOVE?

1 outa 3 ain't bad I guess Fred. :rolleyes:

[triplev123]

...interfer with another horse & go on to win or run in the money history shows you'll invariably be allowed to keep the race/your place cheque?
Why is it that all of a sudden this focus is placed drivers talking on the track or clipping pegs, that is deemed to be more of a priority than the Board similarly instructing the Stewards to use the full extent of the current rule book by way of either relegating or disqualifying horses that have caused interference during a race? Ground Control to Major Tom. Can you hear me Major Tom? Fair dinkum.

[strong persuader]

...interfer with another horse & go on to win or run in the money history shows you'll invariably be allowed to keep the race/your place cheque?
Why is it that all of a sudden this focus is placed drivers talking on the track or clipping pegs, that is deemed to be more of a priority than the Board similarly instructing the Stewards to use the full extent of the current rule book by way of either relegating or disqualifying horses that have caused interference during a race? Ground Control to Major Tom. Can you hear me Major Tom? Fair dinkum.
I know that one should address the minor problems as well, but not before addressing the major ones. Bit like planting the bulbs before preparing the garden bed in my books!
Take more action in regards to drugs and interference and our sport may just rise from the mire of it's latest scandal with brighter prospects. We are all disgusted with episodes like Vertigal's placing in that infamous Gold Tiara Final!

[triplev123]

The Member for Blayney has the Floor. Well said.

[Flashing Red]

I think this is excellent but where was it announced? Can't see it on harness.org.au....

[David Summers]

I think this is excellent but where was it announced? Can't see it on harness.org.au....

It was released here : http://www.hrnsw.com.au/hrnsw-media-release307.html

[David Summers]

Also here: http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=93490

[Flashing Red]

Thank you. :)

[coldshot]

I know that one should address the minor problems as well, but not before addressing the major ones. Bit like planting the bulbs before preparing the garden bed in my books!
Take more action in regards to drugs and interference and our sport may just rise from the mire of it's latest scandal with brighter prospects. We are all disgusted with episodes like Vertigal's placing in that infamous Gold Tiara Final!

I guess this is what Board's do when trying to avoid an elephant that has been around for enough time now to start being bored with sitting in a corner and in all probability is doing the rhumba round the board table.

[tiny]

If I you were a trainer that was using ITPP to treat your team. You know the test is coming it may be 5 months it may be 5 years. Would you stop using it now or keep going and collect as much money as you can now??

They are freezing swabs and say a trainer has 20 frozen swabs they all come positve will this be treated as twenty positives or one??

Let's say some of the leading stables and big name trainers are found to be using ITPP do you think that they will be charged or just told not to use it any more and the files hidden away never to be seen again.

It apears to me that the last thing harness racing needs is a major swab story involving big name trainers. They are happy to just catch a few no namers for TCO2 to look like there doing there but to keep the races clean.

[The Rainmaker]

It apears to me that the last thing harness racing needs is a major swab story involving big name trainers. They are happy to just catch a few no namers for TCO2 to look like there doing there but to keep the races clean.

They've already got a major swab and bribe story with big players involved, yet no mention of it at all at the HRNSW board meeting. I would have thought it would have been the most pressing issue? They'd prefer to focus on coming down hard on drivers contacting marker pegs instead by the looks.

As for ITPP, its out there, and if and when a test becomes available to detect it, what will it cost to test dozens upon dozens of frozen samples months and months later? It wont happen, and if it does only a fraction of samples will be spot tested.

I think you're right, its funny how small trainers are going down for TC02's for seventh placings in the bush yet the big players who are using ITPP continue on their merry way, along with those embroiled in the swabbing and bribing scandal.

They must have one mighty big broom and a hell of a lot of carpet down there at HRNSW headquarters in Bankstown.

[tiny]

I think we may have herd the last of the swab and bribe story

[Diesel]

They've already got a major swab and bribe story with big players involved, yet no mention of it at all at the HRNSW board meeting. I would have thought it would have been the most pressing issue? They'd prefer to focus on coming down hard on drivers contacting marker pegs instead by the looks.

As for ITPP, its out there, and if and when a test becomes available to detect it, what will it cost to test dozens upon dozens of frozen samples months and months later? It wont happen, and if it does only a fraction of samples will be spot tested.

I think you're right, its funny how small trainers are going down for TC02's for seventh placings in the bush yet the big players who are using ITPP continue on their merry way, along with those embroiled in the swabbing and bribing scandal.

They must have one mighty big broom and a hell of a lot of carpet down there at HRNSW headquarters in Bankstown.

Your on the right trail boys.....

They are ignoring the big players much like Admin does here by deleting comments made in a public forum.
Protection is the key word here.....

It wasnt all that long back that comments on here regarding some trainers with positives were left on here as well as pictures with captions.........An even playing field for all is required.

[Flashing Red]

It wasnt all that long back that comments on here regarding some trainers with positives were left on here as well as pictures with captions.........An even playing field for all is required.

You are right, and as you are also aware a BIG effort has been made to clean this forum up in recent months because the drivel that was being said on here was getting out of control. Just because this is a public forum does not mean you can say what you want. If you don't like the rule, don't post on here and don't keep opening new accounts. It's not that hard. It's not about "protecting" a select few industry participants from criticism. It's about making sure Harnesslink doesn't get sued for defamation and keeping the quality of the forum up in general. No-one is getting special treatment.

[ringman]

They've already got a major swab and bribe story with big players involved, yet no mention of it at all at the HRNSW board meeting. I would have thought it would have been the most pressing issue? They'd prefer to focus on coming down hard on drivers contacting marker pegs instead by the looks.

Its been that way for decades and nothing has changed hence the reason Harness racing has the bad name its got but dont blame the battling trainers because they always seem to get the short straw while the Elite seem to do as they please.

As for ITPP, its out there, and if and when a test becomes available to detect it, what will it cost to test dozens upon dozens of frozen samples months and months later? It wont happen, and if it does only a fraction of samples will be spot tested.

I think you're right, its funny how small trainers are going down for TC02's for seventh placings in the bush yet the big players who are using ITPP continue on their merry way, along with those embroiled in the swabbing and bribing scandal.

Funny isnt it how the battlers struggling to stay afloat are always the ones caught while the bigger stables wouldnt think of juicing up their team:p or could it be they are a protected species with different rules to play by.

They must have one mighty big broom and a hell of a lot of carpet down there at HRNSW headquarters in Bankstown.
maybe a sweep of the boardroom would reveal more than meets the eye :confused:



only solution is to clean out the present board and start again anew

[Thevoiceofreason]

This thread is a joke and I am actually embarrassed to be participating with the exception of Fred Hastings the rest is rubbish.

In relation to the ongoing investigation when will you learn it is going to take TIME.

In relation to drug testing the authorities are doing their best as are the labs again it is going to take TIME.

If you are stupid enough to use a substance that it easily detectable you will get caught now.

In relation to the two other rules, they race too tight in NSW we all know it, but if the stewards were came down on it and starting fining drivers for travelling too close to the pegs by hitting them there would be an outcry about revenue raising this rule will assist to lessen interference to some degree .

This announcement simply gives the drivers a warning before action is commenced that is a good move.

I do not like the other rule about talking on the track it is stupid because "one goers" or" help" are not worked out on the track it happens long before that if it happens but it is a perception rule and you would be shocked how many complaints the stewards get about this rule not being enforced. Again when it is enforced the call goes out revenue raising.

You should know VVV you are always accusing the previous ruling body of such things.

This is dumb thread, dumb comments and I may not have helped by adding mine but for everybody's sake be patient and let HRNSW do the job and when the goalposts have been moved for whatever reason do not bag them for at least telling everyone.

[triplev123]

this thread is a joke and i am actually embarrassed to be participating with the exception of fred hastings the rest is rubbish.

[vvv] some of it is, some of it is certainly not.

in relation to the ongoing investigation when will you learn it is going to take time.

[vvv] could not agree more. That has been my repeatedly stated position, as you know full well.

in relation to drug testing the authorities are doing their best as are the labs again it is going to take time.

[vvv] ...and the sun rises in the east & sets in the west. You're stating the obvious here because..........?

if you are stupid enough to use a substance that it easily detectable you will get caught now.

[vvv] good. I don't doubt this. 'twas not always so however.
that so many people are still very, very ticked off is, at the very least, understandable, however inaccurate or misplaced their anger may, from time to time, be. All things considered, i am quite amazed that so many people have taken the news they got back in august or thereabouts as well as they have done. That was not the point of the posts that i have made to this thread, however.

in relation to the two other rules, they race too tight in nsw we all know it, but if the stewards were came down on it and starting fining drivers for travelling too close to the pegs by hitting them there would be an outcry about revenue raising this rule will assist to lessen interference to some degree .

[vvv] why not address interference itself instead of continually dancing around the rule like a bunch of pommies around a maypole?
http://www.woodlands-junior.kent.sch.uk/customs/questions/images/mayday/maypole.jpg

this announcement simply gives the drivers a warning before action is commenced that is a good move.

[vvv] here is where we begin to diverge. For more years than i care to remember stewards across australia have had the opportunity to come down hard on racing interference but they have repeatedly chosen to place it in the too hard basket and aim up on a series of comparitively minor infractions instead. their continued extreme reluctance to fully embrace relegation/setback/disqualification in direct response to interference has had me absolutely baffled and has done for decades. You can't hang your hat on perception rules such as talking on track or whip use or changes of tactics whilst at the same time ignoring interference. The duplicitous nature of that stance is unsustainable.

i do not like the other rule about talking on the track it is stupid because "one goers" or" help" are not worked out on the track it happens long before that if it happens but it is a perception rule and you would be shocked how many complaints the stewards get about this rule not being enforced.

[vvv] how tied up in knots are we going to get ourselves before we realise that perception does not neccessarily = reality????
the labor party is no longer in office here in nsw so there is no need to continue with a reactionary come manage by crisis approach. There's no need to do pretty much anything in order to at least be seen to be doing something. This is a classic sussex st. Machine men approach. Karl bitar would no doubt be proud that the tradition continues, however 'in longer-term destructive' that it may ultimately be.

again when it is enforced the call goes out revenue raising.

[vvv] i certainly didn't mention revenue raising, though others may well have. Rather i made fun of the announcement because to my mind, despite the efforts of successive boards to ignore its presence... The interference elephant continues to sit in the corner of the room. If an announcement had been made to the effect that the board was instructing the stewards to crack down on racing interference you would have heard the cheers for miles.

you should know vvv you are always accusing the previous ruling body of such things.

[vvv]??? Always accusing??? Of such things??? If you're going to make stuff up 'bill'...if you're going to create straw men to knock down...then at the very least be a little more creative in trying to sell to me my shortcomings & those of my position on such issues.
i do not back away from the fact that i've long bagged the utter debacle that was the deplorable, lamentable & thankfully now well & truly defunct ghrra...their faults were many, varied & extensive in nature, but as far as i can recall a criticism of revenue raising was never, ever one of the rockets that i aimed at that organisation. if you can show me evidence to the contrary then i appologise profusely in advance. if not, then perhaps you might see your way clear to do us both a favour & drop the 'such things' routine?

this is dumb thread, dumb comments and i may not have helped by adding mine but for everybody's sake be patient and let hrnsw do the job and when the goalposts have been moved for whatever reason do not bag them for at least telling everyone.

[vvv] as i said above, parts of it are, parts of it are not. It appears you're in the 'ignoring the elephant' camp as far as interference goes. Obviously i am not.



vvv

[Thevoiceofreason]

vvv

I am far from soft on on interference as you know I just do not agree with relegation and never will so debate over on that issue it was under the GHRRA that penalties for such infringements went from a $100 fine to a suspension from driving in races but perhaps you forget that significant change.

On reflection I may have misunderstood one of your previous posts about where the money had gone under the GHRRA so I will cop that on the chin.

[CEdwards81]

I am far from soft on on interference as you know I just do not agree with relegation and never will so debate over on that issue it was under the GHRRA that penalties for such infringements went from a $100 fine to a suspension from driving in races but perhaps you forget that significant change.

On reflection I may have misunderstood one of your previous posts about where the money had gone under the GHRRA so I will cop that on the chin.

So which steward(or ex-steward) are you MR Williams???

[triplev123]

i am far from soft on on interference as you know i just do not agree with relegation and never will so debate over on that issue it was under the ghrra that penalties for such infringements went from a $100 fine to a suspension from driving in races but perhaps you forget that significant change.

[vvv] how you can you be at once 'far from soft on interference' and 'not agree with relegation and never will'?
surely that's akin to the down with capitalism/let's occupy wall st. Crew sitting around bagging free enterprise whilst sending messages to each other on their i-phones?
if far from soft = merely fining & suspending drivers then that's still soft, imo.
the only way you make a real impact is to take the horse down & take the race away. Anything less is just window dressing.
still can't understand why you continue to wrap the ghrra. Going from a fine to a suspension was their way of Karl Bitar-ing the relegation discussion that was going on that the time. Be seen to do something when in reality, it was nothing.
undaunted, you're still flying their flag. It's inexplicable from my perspective.
your knowledge of harness racing is too extensive...so that pretty much rules out you being john coughlan incognito :p. I'm trying to think of who else was there at the time. The timing of some of your posts is rougly equivalent to that of someone now living & working in macau. :rolleyes:

on reflection i may have misunderstood one of your previous posts about where the money had gone under the ghrra so i will cop that on the chin.

[vvv] no dramas. Age will do that to all of us eventually.
next time you're lying in bed watching the discovery channel and i appear on the screen, be sure to think of me fondly. ;)



vvv

[triplev123]

So which steward(or ex-steward) are you MR Williams???

Chris, please...what an impertinent question. Mere mortals such as ourselves must go by our real names whilst those esoterically distant from the lives & concerns of ordinary people are apparently awarded 'Alias' status. :p

[Thevoiceofreason]

Chris, please...what an impertinent question. Mere mortals such as ourselves must go by our real names whilst those esoterically distant from the lives & concerns of ordinary people are apparently awarded 'Alias' status. :p

Such cynics Chris and VVV just because I realise you are not a fan of the GHRRA, VVV or sometimes, and I repeat sometimes agree with the efforts made by the current board and at times the GHRRA does not mean I am not who I purport to be.

I keep trying to tell you the current rule by my reading does not allow relegation and even if it does it it is not policy in Australia not just NSW, also New Zealand where it is a rule it is hardly ever used there are however many suspensions for causing interference.

You do not have to be a steward or ex steward to read the rules they are free on the net so I can afford them.

There is no one more ordinary than me as I wait for my pension each fortnight.

I did not realise you were a TV personality but to be honest and please do not be too offended but to see you pop up in my bedroom larger than life is something that I think would scar me dramatically I hope it is a sight I never see. Which Channel is it again i will change my Foxtel subscription to insure it does not happen.

I am off to watch Bossy Munsie and Bruce on seven to watch the cup. Hope you will not be on there as well

[Flashing Red]

This "who are you?" Is getting old, especially when the same answer is being given. It's not like multiple aliases are being used....

[triplev123]

True, but at the same time it is also a matter of principle Tahn.
It reveals the much vaunted 'real names' policy as being Harnesslink Harness Forum's answer to the NSW Change Of Tactics rule...the nature of its application being similarly 'mercurial'. :rolleyes:

[Flashing Red]

True, but at the same time it is also a matter of principle Tahn.
It reveals the much vaunted 'real names' policy as being Harnesslink Harness Forum's answer to the NSW Change Of Tactics rule...the nature of its application being similarly 'mercurial'. :rolleyes:

I can't see how it is a matter of "principle" when you have no proof that VOR's name is otherwise :)

[triplev123]

As you, similarly, have no proof that it is.
If I had to hang my hat, I think it's Adam Fairley. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Thevoiceofreason]

As you, similarly, have no proof that it is.
If I had to hang my hat, I think it's Adam Fairley. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

He is a good man Adam Fairley happy to be confused with him.

I was actually hoping for Sean Connery, George Clooney or Tom Cruise but you can not have everything.

[tiny]

My guess is Roger neighbor he's on the pension.

[triplev123]

My guess is Roger neighbor he's on the pension.


[VVV] He'd certainly be getting on a bit.
Roger would be sporting a Zimmer Frame by now wouldn't he? :rolleyes:
http://idostuff.co.uk/Images/Zimmer%20frame%20steps%20temporary.JPG

[Flashing Red]

As you, similarly, have no proof that it is.

Yes, but I'm not the one harping on that he isn't who he says he is! :)

[triplev123]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sNRmWWw1yXw/SYnNb-apudI/AAAAAAAAACA/LSmnfzGCAH8/s400/head-in-sand-2.JPG
:rolleyes:

[The Rainmaker]

My guess is Roger neighbor he's on the pension.

I hope it is not Roger Neubauer. The disgraced former steward who was under ICAC investigation for race fixing as well as betting on horse racing and having an owning interest in a pacer with a close friend of his. And the same Roger Neubauer who was caught wining and dining with at the time disqualified repeat offender Peter Morris in Chinatown? If so I would be listening to nothing the bloke has to say, especially in regards to the current swabbing and betting scandal in NSW.

[Thevoiceofreason]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_sNRmWWw1yXw/SYnNb-apudI/AAAAAAAAACA/LSmnfzGCAH8/s400/head-in-sand-2.JPG
:rolleyes:
This must be a photo of VVV's reaction when Harness Racing Australia removed his much loved relegation rule a few years ago, thanks for posting it confirms my suspicions.

[triplev123]

It appears to me that you're verging upon a Regulatory form of Julia Gillard there VOR.
In the same way that she & her Eco-Marxist cronies so deplorably seeks to deny the democratic will of vast majority of the public with regard to her disgracefully undemocratic introduction of a Carbon-dioxide Tax, you seem to revel in the fact that the vast majority of the Harness Racing Industry has thus far been repeatedly denied its view on the significant worth of relegation/setback/disqualification as a direct & very effective stewarding response to racing interference...but of course, Mother knows best. :confused:

[Thevoiceofreason]

It appears to me that you're verging upon a Regulatory form of Julia Gillard there VOR.
In the same way that she & her Eco-Marxist cronies so deplorably seeks to deny the democratic will of vast majority of the public with regard to her disgracefully undemocratic introduction of a Carbon-dioxide Tax, you seem to revel in the fact that the vast majority of the Harness Racing Industry has thus far been repeatedly denied its view on the significant worth of relegation/setback/disqualification as a direct & very effective stewarding response to racing interference...but of course, Mother knows best. :confused:

Unfortunately they all want it until it effects them.... then like most other rules it should not have been used now.

Like Julia Gillard someone put HRA in power and this decision was made years ago if you are right and most want it back where is the Australia wide push and one last question if it is such a great rule why don't NZ use it.

[gregcattell]

N.Z does not follow H.R.A.rules L J did not get time for
positive SU still aloud to race while inquiry was still on
not like in Australia depends on what horse it is I suppose
talk about unfair

[Thevoiceofreason]

N.Z does not follow H.R.A.rules L J did not get time for
positive SU still aloud to race while inquiry was still on
not like in Australia depends on what horse it is I suppose
talk about unfair
Why would anyone expect New Zealand to follow the Australian Rules they have to work within there own framework it has nothing to do with which horse it is.

[starkmarty]

Here`s just another small example of the distain Board menbers ( in particular, Les Bentley, as President of Bankstown HRC) have for trainers. The disfunctional Committee of Bankstown Harness Racing Club have just advised trainers and residents of the `Monster Fireworks Display 12th November`.
Without any regard for the welfare of resident horses, this laughable lot have approved this potentially disastrous action on behalf of the Annual Muslim Show.
Yet another example of conflict of interest by HRNSW, and some board members.
How this lot survives is beyond me.
A few years ago, I lost a very good horse through one of these fireworks displays, (Doug Bromac; 20+ wins) when he crashed through a fence in fright.
How people can sell themselves for a plate of sandwich`s and the illusion of power is sad.
The sooner they go the better. Martin Herbert, Trainer/Driver/ Breeder/ Owner

[ringman]

Martin thats amazing these people can let this happen knowing what a horse can do to itself and others when spooked.

[Flashing Red]

Here`s just another small example of the distain Board menbers ( in particular, Les Bentley, as President of Bankstown HRC) have for trainers. The disfunctional Committee of Bankstown Harness Racing Club have just advised trainers and residents of the `Monster Fireworks Display 12th November`.
Without any regard for the welfare of resident horses, this laughable lot have approved this potentially disastrous action on behalf of the Annual Muslim Show.
Yet another example of conflict of interest by HRNSW, and some board members.
How this lot survives is beyond me.
A few years ago, I lost a very good horse through one of these fireworks displays, (Doug Bromac; 20+ wins) when he crashed through a fence in fright.
How people can sell themselves for a plate of sandwich`s and the illusion of power is sad.
The sooner they go the better. Martin Herbert, Trainer/Driver/ Breeder/ Owner

Very sorry to hear your plight. :( Perhaps the resident trainers can invest in some ear plugs and tranquiliser? Not ideal but would be an absolute shame to loose a horse due to it :( Just trying to think proactively....

[triplev123]

Martin, I fear you've misjudged Les in this instance. I've no doubt that his intentions are well-meaning.
By way of the use of a Monster Fireworks Display they're simply seeking to bring back, for all those assembled, pleasant memories of Beruit circa 1975-1990. :p

There is a whisper around the traps that Peter Dewsbury will be dressed as Yasser Arafat...although I have been unable to confirm. ;);););)

[teecee]

Say what...
In NZ the relegation rule does exist and is applied in nearly 70% of all interference protests lodged. i.e. case proven..
Suspensions in NZ are few and far between. They are applied when careless driving results in a smash / fall or when a horseperson chooses suspension over a fine. They are given a choice of penalty here. Some horsepeople can't afford a fine while others have so many commitments a suspension is only punishing innocents like owners.

the current rule by my reading does not allow relegation and even if it does it it is not policy in Australia not just NSW, also New Zealand where it is a rule it is hardly ever used there are however many suspensions for causing interference.

[starkmarty]

Martin, I fear you've misjudged Les in this instance. I've no doubt that his intentions are well-meaning.
By way of the use of a Monster Fireworks Display they're simply seeking to bring back, for all those assembled, pleasant memories of Beruit circa 1975-1990. :p

There is a whisper around the traps that Peter Dewsbury will be dressed as Yasser Arafat...although I have been unable to confirm. ;);););)


Not bad triplev123, but maybe too close to the truth! Last year we had array of fireworks, bangers etc going off right behind our barn here in Condell Park.
Most horses were going beserk, so we done our best to settle them down.
I was furious after the Doug Bromac incident the previous year. He was a valuable animal, winning us over $150,000 in prizemoney. He never won another race after his injuries.

We went for a drive around to the parallel street and there they were, in the middle of the road, setting off the `big display`. These were locals, but not maybe born on our shores. After expressing our concern, we were threatened with violence.

In my opinion, as a previous President, Treasurer and Director of Bankstown Harness Racing Club, I put local concerns first, and that means trainers, drivers, owners and last but certainly not least, the horses themselves.

That is not the concern of the incumbent Committee, and I have many incidents to support this position.

Spin and `BS`rule the day! ie, their claim to be `Sydney`s Home of Harness racing`. Good Grief`

The inside `sand` track went without any topping for 9 months due to lack of funds.
This was primarily bought about by losing almost all funding from our sister club, the Bankstown Trotting and Recreational Club.

They had a problem with threats from Les Bentley and rightly so. These funds are most unlikely to be offered again so there is only one direction for this once proud and historic club now. Extinction.
His lame duck, rubber stamp Committee simply follow along, as he is a `NSWHR Board Member`, so he must be right! Yeah, right.
Do I have an axe to grind?
No, as I have resigned and not run for any position for 2 years. If the members want them, Have `em!
My plans lay elsewhere.

[triplev123]

You've missed my point there mate, that was just meant to be funny, nothing else.
I would not know Les if I fell over him but Peter's long been a mate of mine & he is married to the sister of another mate of mine. The thought of Peter appearing on the night dressed up as the late PLO Chairman kinda tickled my fancy, that's all. Take it easy Trooper, you'll blow a valve.

[starkmarty]

You've missed my point there mate, that was just meant to be funny, nothing else.
I would not know Les if I fell over him but Peter's long been a mate of mine & he is married to the sister of another mate of mine. The thought of Peter appearing on the night dressed up as the late PLO Chairman kinda tickled my fancy, that's all. Take it easy Trooper, you'll blow a valve.

Yes you are right vvv, I should not take it too seriously. And I did get a good laugh from your post.
I guess it`s just a hard game this without big rewards- for most.
I dont normally have much to do with forums and the to and fro that goes on, but fireworks and horses just don`t mix.
I`ve decided to load my horses on my truck just before detonation and take a drive for 30 minutes.
Everything, including me, will have calmed down by then.
And I do realise clubs need income from many areas, including Muslim `Festivals`

[triplev123]

Martin, you do have my sympathies re: the Fireworks. I think that's crazy. Years ago I was on course at Penrith & they started up a fireworks display(one which everyone had been notified about) but for reasons only known to themselves they did it before the allotted time for all of the horses to be out of there...& their reactions were frightening. Some of them went absolutely troppo. Similar to what happens in a really bad lightning/thunderstorm.

[starkmarty]

Martin, you do have my sympathies re: the Fireworks. I think that's crazy. Years ago I was on course at Penrith & they started up a fireworks display(one which everyone had been notified about) but for reasons only known to themselves they did it before the allotted time for all of the horses to be out of there...& their reactions were frightening. Some of them went absolutely troppo. Similar to what happens in a really bad lightning/thunderstorm.


Well vvv others with a better memory than might recall the late stratching of the favourite, Jack Morris I think, for the Miracle Mile many years ago. I was there and prior to the race Vince Sylvestro put on one of his shows ( and a mighty show it was too, just at the wrong venue ).
Jack was a late scratching at the barrier when blood was detected from one nostril. His trainer claimed he had reacted violently to the bangers and hit his head.
Horses rarely bled in the prelim and Jack went on to win other races so Sean Harney was probably right.
Nevertheless, my solution is easy as I outlined previously; a drive around for a bit.:cool:

[triplev123]

Well vvv others with a better memory than might recall the late stratching of the favourite, Jack Morris I think, for the Miracle Mile many years ago. I was there and prior to the race Vince Sylvestro put on one of his shows ( and a mighty show it was too, just at the wrong venue ).
Jack was a late scratching at the barrier when blood was detected from one nostril. His trainer claimed he had reacted violently to the bangers and hit his head.
Horses rarely bled in the prelim and Jack went on to win other races so Sean Harney was probably right.
Nevertheless, my solution is easy as I outlined previously; a drive around for a bit.:cool:

[VVV] Geeze, there's a blast from the past.
I don't know how the Hell it was that Sean managed to avoid scoring a Bute positive with that horse. He used to get a tub of it out & scoop a couple of fingers into it and jam a big blob or two of it into the horse's mouth. Other days, other ways I guess. Harney reminded me a fair bit of Vin Knight. He was different but struck me as a real character.

[aussiebreno]

Heard a good one about a bleeder. It won the race and a journo came up for an interview. The strapper had took the horse away fearing they would get found out and the winning connections had a photo snapped for the local rag with 'their' horse. Get this though; the bleeder was a bay horse...the horse snapped in the picture was grey!

[starkmarty]

[VVV] Geeze, there's a blast from the past.
I don't know how the Hell it was that Sean managed to avoid scoring a Bute positive with that horse. He used to get a tub of it out & scoop a couple of fingers into it and jam a big blob or two of it into the horse's mouth. Other days, other ways I guess. Harney reminded me a fair bit of Vin Knight. He was different but struck me as a real character.


Too right. Sean was a bit ahead of his time in some ways but he was not short on talent. Vinny I had the pleasure of staying with when I took my former great juvenile, Hanover Schell, down to Melbourne to contest a couple of feature races circa 1980.
Both him and his father made me most welcome and I was gobsmacked when Vin shown me the wad he collected when we saluted at MV .
He had told me his work ( Hanover Schell) at Kilmore was that of a certainty! Being a young and green Kiwi punting was not my priority as at the time I was courting more than one $100,000 offer. Big dough then, and still tidy money now.

I just wish a horse of that calibre had come along a bit later when I knew the ropes better!

[The Form Student]

I remember Hanover Schell having it's first star as a 2YO at Fairfield.........it was backed from 50's in, and got the cash........someone please confirm my memory.

[Daryl New]

Heres one for you. Given the supposed issue of substances supposedly remaining in a horses system and thus returning a positive above the internationally recognised levels, why not give those trainers/owners, when receiving or transferring a horse an at cost service of freezing swab samples on the arrival of said horse at the stables. Of course we would all have to accept he integrity of the laboratories providing this service and the collection process. At least we would until a positive occurred and then we would go into shock and attempt to discredit the integrity of everyone except our current favourite participants.
At the same time, No one be allowed near horses before they are swabbed, particularly at presentations and All participants to wear gloves when handling horses to prevent external applications of illegal substances. Or as all people enter all sections of a racecourse they apply Dettol handwash to ensure they are not carrying any prohibited substances on there hands, but wait why not airport xrays at every entrabce to ensure they have no prohibited products for application on their person.
While Im at it, lets continue the practise of protracted legal action to delay any application of penalty, hang on, even enquiries into positive swabs or questionable behaviour. In fact we could allocate money from the budget ( are you listening Julia ) to assist only those who can afford protracted legal action to delay and obfuscate these issues. Getup wouldnt be at work on these forums would they.

[Harold Parker]

Stewards queried the driving tactics of B Hewitt (SCREAMAN SEAMAN) in particular over the final 600 metres of the event where after settling in a one wide position approaching the 400 metres SCREAMAN SEAMAN was held up between runners and failed to gain clear running until approximately the 200 metre mark. When questioned driver B Hewitt stated that he believed the horse he was trailing namely CIRCUMSTANTIAL was going to carry him into the race. When this did not occur he was held when RENEGING had moved to his outside. He further stated that he did not believe it was in SCREAMAN SEAMAN’s best interests to progress four wide rounding the turn. In view of the circumstances driver B Hewitt’s explanation was noted for future reference.

Odds On FAV hoping for a 1000-1 shot to carrying him into the race. Not in the horses best interest of the horse to come Four Wide rounding the turn. Are you kidding me ? Meanwhile the heavily supported stablemate "pinches" it.

So Panella gets 28 days for honestly admitting to stewards that her drive on Daryl's horse wasn't the best. The younger B Hewitt talks a load of BS on an Odds On Fav with the heavily supported stablemate streaking away on the engine and the stewards lap it up. Where's the consistency from these Bozo's ?

[The Form Student]

I think this is all "circumstantial" evidence..........lol!.......... you are right, Menangle has the most beautiful sweeping home turn, that is supposed to give every runner the opportunity to finish their races off..........you should take the opportunity, especially if you are travelling well!......come out 3 wide and sit their until the top of the straight, then go for home!.........change the track name to Maitland........then that would be a different story!

[Harold Parker]

"in particular over the final 600 metres of the event"

Well how about the the first 600m of the event. At it's two previous races Screamin Seaman ran the gate at Bathurst couldn't cross but had a serious dip in 28.5. The start before going for a spell it fired out from 3 took a trail in a much tougher race and got the chocolates at Menangle. Yet on Friday night not one ounce of urgency at despatch drifting back to worse than midfield. Other than a stablemate drawn wider running the gate, why the change of tactics ?

What an inept bunch of stewards. Take the blinkers off Boys and Girls.

[tiny]

Hi Daryl,
I don't real understand the point you are trying to get across.

At the end of the day the rule says that a trainer must present the horse at the races free of all prohibited sustances. It is a tough on to beat and pretty much means if you get a positive your guilty and doesn't really matter how it got there.

Like you said the thing of late where you can just keep delaying the inevitable pretty much for ever is a complete joke and has to stop once upon a time all open enquires were listed on the web sight. IMO this stopped about the sametime as the rediculace time lengths started. I would love to know how many open swab enquires there is I can think of six with out trying.

When Reid Sanders first started there was the big day of bicarb hearings. The front page of the trot guide says Reid gets tough on drugs. Its been a big disappoint since
I also don't like HRNSWs policy that all positives are the same whatever the substance is wrong to treat them all the same when they are not is silly.

I'm not shore if you were hinting a LMc in your post or not. But his swab is a little different something funny is going on here. I can't think of another boldenone swob at the trots ever then two in the on night from two different trainers. Both with no history of swabs and the fact boldenone is long lasting and there have been clear swabs shortly before and after is strange.

Many people think LMc has the silver bullet to improve horses boldenone isn't it.

[Harold Parker]

I've spoken to one and I have no clue of their background. What they need on stewards panels is at least one guy a night on the job who thinks like a punter. Without the support of the punter there's no industry.

The inquiry should never of been completed in a hurry on Friday. It warranted further investigation. From what I hear on the grapevine, the winner was very heavily supported on the exchanges. The Fav was easy.

Wakey Wakey, even if nothing sinister occured, it should be fully checked. They've got their eyes off the ball.

[The Form Student]

I have watched the replay several times, it was really one of those cases where everything went against BPH, the horse 3 wide RollonGiget did not give ground quick enough, and only gave ground at the same rate as Circumstantial gave ground, and this carted Screaman Seaman back a few lengths and the opportunity to win was gone, .........even Reneging held him up around the turn.............he was then the fesh horse on the scene we he got clear and he did "scream" to the line. If you check the back straight shot BPH did come out half a cart 3 wide, and saw Rollon Gidget still there, and went back in........at this point he obviously decided his best chance was to follow Circumstantial. I will give BPH the benefit of the doubt! Can't take away from stablemate he did the work outside the leader and won the race......if BJH had let Rollon Gidget take the death......then SS would have most likely won pretty easily!!

[Harold Parker]

I have watched the replay several times, it was really one of those cases where everything went against BPH, the horse 3 wide RollonGiget did not give ground quick enough, and only gave ground at the same rate as Circumstantial gave ground, and this carted Screaman Seaman back a few lengths and the opportunity to win was gone, .........even Reneging held him up around the turn.............he was then the fesh horse on the scene we he got clear and he did "scream" to the line. If you check the back straight shot BPH did come out half a cart 3 wide, and saw Rollon Gidget still there, and went back in........at this point he obviously decided his best chance was to follow Circumstantial. I will give BPH the benefit of the doubt! Can't take away from stablemate he did the work outside the leader and won the race......if BJH had let Rollon Gidget take the death......then SS would have most likely won pretty easily!!

Dunno what you do for a crust Steve but have you ever thought of becoming a steward ? : )

[The Form Student]

Dunno what you do for a crust Steve but have you ever thought of becoming a steward ? : )

That's cheeky!..........to be honest with you...........I hate doing my money, and all I ask is for is my share of luck in running, I make a decision on a race on who I like etc, and bet accordingly............but I don't have control of luck in running, it can vary from 0-100%, and so often decides the result, apart from the horse, it's driver, the track, the other runners etc.
In the race we are talking about, Screaman Seaman "should have won" bit it didn't.........it won't be the first or last time this happens! The horse landed 1-2 back in running, perfect!........a horse gets caught 3 wide and decided to stay there rather going foward or back........it happens......the driver makes a decision to follow the 1-1 horse rather than a horse that has been 3 wide since the outset.......I can't say this was a bad decision......SS gets completely taken back through the field to the point where the ground to make up is too much.......and we know the result......the other option in this would have been to follow Rollon Gidget 3 wide early, pull 4 wide and go and race outside leader, I am sure BJH would have let BPH have the spot!.........SS seems to run better when held up for a final sprint and that was the tactic to be employed, but the circumstances of the race did not allow SS to get the required run to show it's best ability!
Now, if you think I have got this wrong.......please give me your explanation of where.......because all I have done is describe how the race unfolded!
I have analysed races, trials etc., over a long period of time.....I don't care how good your form study is........you still need luck, and that luck can range from 0-100%.......all you can ask for is your fair share over time.......then if your form is good, you will come out in front. How many times have you been on the "wrong foot" when having a punt, never get any luck in running, driver does not drive the way you expect, every photo finish goes against you.........then other times your "walking on water" can't do a thing wrong! Puntingis frustrating.......my only advise is to stick to your opinion, don't get put off by the odds, and hang in there........so won't go crazy then!
I don't think they would employ a punter as a steward, but as a form researcher for the stewards......then I would jump at this........I know they have form experts advising the stewards panels at the gallops!
My occupation is in finance!

[Old Frank]

Heres one for you. Given the supposed issue of substances supposedly remaining in a horses system and thus returning a positive above the internationally recognised levels, why not give those trainers/owners, when receiving or transferring a horse an at cost service of freezing swab samples on the arrival of said horse at the stables. Of course we would all have to accept he integrity of the laboratories providing this service and the collection process. At least we would until a positive occurred and then we would go into shock and attempt to discredit the integrity of everyone except our current favourite participants.
At the same time, No one be allowed near horses before they are swabbed, particularly at presentations and All participants to wear gloves when handling horses to prevent external applications of illegal substances. Or as all people enter all sections of a racecourse they apply Dettol handwash to ensure they are not carrying any prohibited substances on there hands, but wait why not airport xrays at every entrabce to ensure they have no prohibited products for application on their person.
While Im at it, lets continue the practise of protracted legal action to delay any application of penalty, hang on, even enquiries into positive swabs or questionable behaviour. In fact we could allocate money from the budget ( are you listening Julia ) to assist only those who can afford protracted legal action to delay and obfuscate these issues. Getup wouldnt be at work on these forums would they.

There's a soapbox rant of rubbish if I've ever seen one!

[Daryl New]

There's a soapbox rant of rubbish if I've ever seen one!
Not a rant OLD FRANK/Nathan just looking at the ridiculousness of the process and expressing frustration that the legal system lets us down. Some on the track today thought that the transfer swabbing a good idea Even sold shares in the freezing and storage company

[teecee]

I don't think they would employ a punter as a steward, but as a form researcher for the stewards......then I would jump at this........I know they have form experts advising the stewards panels at the gallops!
My occupation is in finance![/QUOTE]

The RIU here were looking for such a person currently.. If you can handle getting up 2 hours earlier (but you do get to go to bed 2 hrs later)


The Racing Integrity Unit (RIU) manages the application of, and adherence to the Rules of Racing for Thoroughbred, Greyhound and Harness Racing in New Zealand.

A vacancy now exists for part-time Betting Analyst (3 days per week) to join the RIU and contribute to the effective operation of racing and ensure that the rules and regulations both on and off-course are followed and adhered too, with the result that racing is conducted with integrity and there is enhanced public confidence in our industry.

The role includes but is not limited to
• Investigating form.
• Analysing betting and betting trends across the three racing codes.
• Develop and maintain relationships with the New Zealand TAB and overseas betting agencies.
• Providing daily information to Stipendiary Stewards on live betting trends.
• Assisting in hearings before the Judicial Control Authority.

A flexible approach to working hours is required due to the requirements of the industry. Some travel within New Zealand may be required. The role is based in Auckland.

You will have an extensive knowledge of betting and racing and be familiar with the industry as a whole. A high level of competency in IT operations, an ability to meet deadlines, and a high standard of analytical, written and verbal skills are required.

Importantly the appointee will be able to demonstrate a high level of integrity and apply decisions consistently and objectively.

This role is part-time however there is a possibility it could become full-time in the future.

Please forward your CV and covering letter by email to admin@riu.org.nz (admin@riu.org.nz).

A position description is available on the RIU website www.riu.org.nz (http://www.riu.org.nz).

Applications close at 5pm Monday 16 January 2012.



Sorry it's closed.
But you could still make enquiries. I can't imagine there's anyone in NZ for that job..!!

[The Form Student]

teecee, I would love that job, I spend hours pulling form apart, trying to compare tracks, going back after races to consider the results and form etc......I will now keep an eye out for future positions!!!!

[Thevoiceofreason]

For the record boys the betting steward or form steward at the Gallops in NSW is most certainly a former punter.

[The Form Student]

For the record boys the betting steward or form steward at the Gallops in NSW is most certainly a former punter.

I wonder how they measure their ability?

[Thevoiceofreason]

I wonder how they measure their ability?

Steve

It is a little different in the gallops the "form steward" is based in Sydney he attends all metro and some midweek provincial meetings he also monitors betfair and advises stewards throughout the state of unusual betting trends on certain horses. I have not included him in the information below.

As I have preached before it is all about money and everyone wants integrity and noone wants to fund it, for example comparing apples with apples.

Average NSW Metro Gallops Panel 6 stewards---- Harness 4.

Average NSW Provincial Gallops Panel ( Newcastle) 4 stewards---- Harness 2

Average NSW Country Gallops ( Muswellbrook) 3 stewards--- Harness 2

so whilst ever we continue to under staff the stewards panels things will be missed it is as simple as that, they the stewards are not supermen.

[Harold Parker]

Stewards queried the driving tactics of B Hewitt (SCREAMAN SEAMAN) in particular over the final 600 metres of the event where after settling in a one wide position approaching the 400 metres SCREAMAN SEAMAN was held up between runners and failed to gain clear running until approximately the 200 metre mark. When questioned driver B Hewitt stated that he believed the horse he was trailing namely CIRCUMSTANTIAL was going to carry him into the race. When this did not occur he was held when RENEGING had moved to his outside. He further stated that he did not believe it was in SCREAMAN SEAMAN’s best interests to progress four wide rounding the turn. In view of the circumstances driver B Hewitt’s explanation was noted for future reference.

Odds On FAV hoping for a 1000-1 shot to carrying him into the race. Not in the horses best interest of the horse to come Four Wide rounding the turn. Are you kidding me ? Meanwhile the heavily supported stablemate "pinches" it.

So Panella gets 28 days for honestly admitting to stewards that her drive on Daryl's horse wasn't the best. The younger B Hewitt talks a load of BS on an Odds On Fav with the heavily supported stablemate streaking away on the engine and the stewards lap it up. Where's the consistency from these Bozo's ?

Screamin Seaman was beaten a half head today. Attacked Grand Stride for the lead in 26 and change. Sat parked before going after Grand Stride again from the 600m getting the better of him (2-7 Fav) in deep stretch before being nailed late one of Neil Day's which had the dream trip just off them ... in 1.53 and change !!

Amazing what happens when there isn't a heavily supported stablemate on the engine in need of protection.

[doncht]

Hi guys, any recent tips for this one so far? https://imagicon.info/cat/10-3/smile4.png

[Messenger]

The day after the last post in this thread which you resurrected Don, was Feb 29 in 2012 - a leap year, so my tip is that it is only 6mths till our next leap year.
Just sayin but it is good to have someone to talk to Don, you're tracking as number 1 poster of late.

[Danno]

Almost couldn't believe my eyes when I read this......I wonder how many others might have got bitten, this one went on for something like 6 years!!!!!


http://www.harnesslink.com/International/Trainer-cops-ten-years-disqualification

[Greg Hando]

I can't believe you would be paying up for a horse without sighting it or having it at least trial in 6 years.
Michael Jnr has a positive swab to bi carb as well now.

[Adaptor]

Agree Greg
Something is not right here !
Mythical horse, and 6 years of payment?

[mightymo]

you should listen to an interview Shane Anderson did this morning with Reid Sanders regarding the situation.

The person in question is quite elderly and did make attempts to see the horse

[Danno]

you should listen to an interview Shane Anderson did this morning with Reid Sanders regarding the situation.

The person in question is quite elderly and did make attempts to see the horse



thanks Harvey, don't suppose you have a link or any other info?

[mightymo]

thanks Harvey, don't suppose you have a link or any other info?

https://audioboom.com/publishing/playlist/v4?autoplay=false&bg_fill_col=transparent;boo_content_type=channel&data_for_content_type=3300667&image_option=small&link_color=%2358d1eb&player_theme=light&show_title=true&src=https%3A%2F%2Fapi.audioboom.com%2Fchannels%2F3 300667%2Faudio_clips%3Finclude_child_channels%3D1&player_theme=dark&link_color=%2358d1eb&image_option=small&show_title=true&border-radius:5px&max_height=590px#Reid Sanders COO Harness Racing NSW following the suspension handed down to Michael Day yesterday

[mightymo]

not sure if that worked.

Go to rsn.net.au and scroll down under "listen again" till you find the Reid Sanders interview

[doncht]

Looks like they took it out already. https://imagicon.info/cat/10-3/smile4.png