Swayzee or Leap To Fame

[trish]

I will cop some flack but I do not care .

Who is the better horse ??
I am going to say Swayzee.

Swayzee has done so much more than LTF .
2 NZ cups , enough said .
Plus all else he has achieved , since Mr Grimson took control .
He is also going to Perth for the Nullarbor. LTF is not . Jason doesn't worry about travelling Swayzee at all .
He just won $500 thou by travelling to 5 country cups .
He should have won them all IMO.

Thoughts????

[Messenger]

LTF
No NZ Cups but an Inter and a MM

There are no doubts cast on whether LTF is legit as he was a good 2yo and a champion 3yo (pretty much why he has twice as many Gp1's)
Fairly or unfairly there are Swayzee doubters based on how quickly Grimson turned him into a superstar.

It could be argued that this is unfair based on the fact that the two are ½ brothers.
If Grimson had not won 2 Inters turning around claimers in fast time there would probably be far less conjecture

LTF has better gate speed and has won many races the tough way.
If LTF was my horse, I would have Cam Hart driving him.

I might have to look at a few replays tomorrow to confirm my opinion

ps Should Swayzee's Penrith and Tamworth wins have an extra $250k next to them.
I guess bonuses are tricky and like the fact that HRA does not make it clear that his NZ winnings are in his prizemoney, I guess the bonus money is there somewhere too

[Danno]

Have to say LTF on the basis of the margins when they have met. LTF has run away from his older gelded brother whereas Swayzee has never done the same to LTF.

I have always believed and witnessed first hand that Stallions are just a tad stronger overall than geldings (due to the naturally higher levels of testosterone) and so if Swayzee had been able to race with his testicles it may be a different outcome. I have no idea why he was castrated either, maybe it was a convenience thing as is often the case.

I think we also need to take into consideration Swayzee is a year older and as we know toughness and "ring craft" increase with age until the peak has been passed.

They are both tough as teak customers and far better horses than Ive had anything to do with, but If I had to make a choice the one that can beat up his older brother is the one I would pick.

And Kev, on the subject of drivers, I would be careful not to underestimate the value of the relationship between the horse and the bum in the cart, it is even more difficult to measure than racetimes and statisitics.

Cheers.

[Messenger]

And Kev, on the subject of drivers, I would be careful not to underestimate the value of the relationship between the horse and the bum in the cart, it is even more difficult to measure than racetimes and statisitics.

Cheers.

I am sure you are right Dan although I reckon Cam would have been very happy to dedicate himself to LTF but that probably cannot replicate the trainer&driver relationship

[trish]

Hi Dan ,

I should have worded it different & said , as older horses who is the best .
I agree with what both you & Kev have said.
LTF is a champ .

I just feel if they raced each other , say in NZ or WA , I would be interested to see who would win .

Being a gelding , Swayzee seems to handle travel so well & Leap has had things go wrong .
Are both going to the Grins in NZ ?

Maybe they could organise a match race , like with Satinover & Pure Steel .
Gosh weren't they amazing horses .

[trish]

That match race was back in 1980 & I remember it well .

[trish]

I am sure you are right Dan although I reckon Cam would have been very happy to dedicate himself to LTF but that probably cannot replicate the trainer&driver relationship

When you train & drive your horses you know them inside out.
Cam is a great driver , he thinks .
If he did drive Leap , It would be interesting to see who he would drive in my match race. Hahaha

[trish]

If you watch the Match Race on you tube , just check out the crowd .

[Messenger]

The link to the match race

https://www.google.com/search?q=Satinover+and+Pure+Steel+match+race&oq=Satinover+and+Pure+Steel+match+race&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOTIICAEQABgWGB4yDQgCEA AYhgMYgAQYigUyDQgDEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyDQgEEAAYhgMYgAQY igUyDQgFEAAYhgMYgAQYigUyCggGEAAYgAQYogQyBwgHEAAY7w UyCggIEAAYogQYiQUyBwgJEAAY7wXSAQoyMDMxNGowajE1qAIM sAIB8QVd9rXv3_mDzg&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#cobssid=s&fpstate=ive&vld=cid:85890b79,vid:vUL3dwazZfs,st:0

I won't give it away as we may have a few younger followers

EVERYBODY SHOULD WATCH IT JUST TO SEE WHAT SIZE CROWD THEY COULD PULL IN 1980

and to see that a 2 horse race can be exciting (probably more exciting than a 3 or 4 horse race can ever be)

ps Thanks Trish

[Mighty Atom]

If you watch the Match Race on you tube , just check out the crowd .

Hi trish, what a night 20,000 people I was there those were the days. Pure Steel rearing up to have a go at Satinover added to the pre-race drama.

[trish]

Hi trish, what a night 20,000 people I was there. Pure Steel rearing up to have a go at Satinover added to the pre-race drama. I know everyone has seen it but here it is again on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/100063474969780/videos/1980-the-match-race-of-the-century-pure-steel-v-satinover/353896956568737/


Thanks Rod . Wow , that would have been very special to be there. Brilliant .

[Messenger]

I just watched Swayzee's NZ Cup wins again.
Last November's win was really something

https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=00942B11-32D5-43FA-816A-C9D0D6748B58&Arg=hrnzg-rSite&Arg=TRUE