For a reason 1:50!!!

[Maorisidol]

As Excel Stride attacks leader Mach Beauty in a 26.7, second quarter, For A Reason sits back and let's go round the turn to win by 20m in a fantastic 1:50 flat!
Good to see him run such a time and let's hope he can repeat such an effort.

[ScabsCat]

Further to my thread entitled 'Lauren Panella' from last week, this time we had the roles reversed and Lukey doing the attacking in 26 quarters carving up the $1.20 favourite driven by Panella. Was always going to happen after the job Panella did on him last week went unpunished!

[craig]

Hey Jeff. Watched a replay of the race and i dont think anything Luke did was payback. I doubt when you have horses of this quality they worry about playing games. The last thing they would want to do is flatten there horses when they have so many big races coming up in the next few weeks. Go watch the race again and i think you will see Lukes horses started to over race down the back straight. Nothing more then that.

[ScabsCat]

Ummm.....yeah....Excel Stride always pulls in it's races and Luke regularly has trouble holding horses lol

[Hollie]

Well obviously Excel Stride really wanted to go and Luke being the experienced driver knew that it was too early for that. Remember Luke is not a superhuman, he doesn't have the strength of ten men.

[Pena]

I think there is a groundswell of people within the industry that have had a gutful of Lauren and her belief that the front is hers and look out if you think its not. I understand why she has this attitude as 90% of her winners lead and when she drives one of the pace her win percentage is far inferior.

[aussiebreno]

I think there is a groundswell of people within the industry that have had a gutful of Lauren and her belief that the front is hers and look out if you think its not. I understand why she has this attitude as 90% of her winners lead and when she drives one of the pace her win percentage is far inferior.
I don't know if thats partularly true or not but for sake of my post, lets just say its true. It's a good tactic to employ. Might ruin a few horses chance here and there because would have been better off handing up. But if Lauren, or any driver, gets a reputation for holding the front at all costs, it can very well pay dividends in the future with getting soft leads and/or left alone in front.

[Sofoulis]

(note: vested interest as Lauren regularly drives my horses and led/won on my horse on Saturday @ Menangle)

The lead clearly is a prized position, but it is not pre-determined. If others want the lead, have the gate speed and the ability to back it up at the end of a race, then it is equally theirs for the taking.
Lauren (or anyone) handing up on a $1.70 favourite over a mile that has done all of its best racing in front would be more of an issue. My horse led and won from gate 2 and had to contest for the lead early-on but backed it up by holding on at the finishing post - if she hadn't had fought for the lead, it would be a different story. I can understand your point Jack, if Lauren was leading at all costs and the horse's compounding most of the time then I would expect people to be very frustrated. But I think she is weighing up the horse's ability and delivering at a decent strike rate which suggests she is employing the right tactics for the right horses more often than not.

In my (uneducated) opinion, the unfortunate over-racing of Excel Stride taints the great effort of For A Reason's win in 1.50 - but F.A.R's performance means he probably would have won regardless of the tactics intentionally or unintentionally employed by anyone in the race.

[Maorisidol]

Thanku Sofoulis,
"In my (uneducated) opinion, the unfortunate over-racing of Excel Stride taints the great effort of For A Reason's win in 1.50 - but F.A.R's performance means he probably would have won regardless of the tactics intentionally or unintentionally employed by anyone in the race."
This thread was created about For A Reason not Lauren or her driving tactics or Luke wanting the lead, its to celebrate a former great juvenile fighting back to some glory at an older age and how that is good for racing and our sport...
If you want to talk about Lauren then as Scabscat mentioned, he has a whole thread dedicated to her, out of about 7 posts in this thread not one person until Sofoulis actually mentioned FAR...

So does anyone apart from Sofoulis have anyone anything to say about him???

[ScabsCat]

Thanku Sofoulis,
"In my (uneducated) opinion, the unfortunate over-racing of Excel Stride taints the great effort of For A Reason's win in 1.50 - but F.A.R's performance means he probably would have won regardless of the tactics intentionally or unintentionally employed by anyone in the race."
This thread was created about For A Reason not Lauren or her driving tactics or Luke wanting the lead, its to celebrate a former great juvenile fighting back to some glory at an older age and how that is good for racing and our sport...
If you want to talk about Lauren then as Scabscat mentioned, he has a whole thread dedicated to her, out of about 7 posts in this thread not one person until Sofoulis actually mentioned FAR...

So does anyone apart from Sofoulis have anyone anything to say about him???

Yes, well.....For A Reason would have finished in the same place it settled(3 pegs) if the leaders weren't carving out 26 quarters up front, the same as Mister Presley would have finished back with the cap catchers the week before if Panella didn't serve it up to the leader. Im looking forward to some great battles between these two leading stables over the next few months, and a few more Steven Bradbury moments when they do......

[Greg Hando]

For A Reason was simply stunning to beat the calibre of horse's by some 20 mts, no easy feat running the sectional's they did. I'm dirty my mare didn't get in foal to him last season but them's the break's.

[Maorisidol]

Yes, well.....For A Reason would have finished in the same place it settled(3 pegs) if the leaders weren't carving out 26 quarters up front, the same as Mister Presley would have finished back with the cap catchers the week before if Panella didn't serve it up to the leader. Im looking forward to some great battles between these two leading stables over the next few months, and a few more Steven Bradbury moments when they do......
So do you not rate FAR's performance?

[ScabsCat]

He went outstanding, but had conditions run to suit at the same time.

[Boydy]

Fantastic run by For a Reason. But how good must Beautide be. He might be the next ex-Tassie superstar since Flashing Red.

[Pena]

Adam you are right I think you are somewhat blinded by your allegiances. Watch this space as like I said previously alot of people have a gutfull of the attitude and it seems very coincidental that in the last two weeks two horses have taken control of their drivers, Suave Stuey for the Red Army and Excel for the Blue and Green Army. Coincidence that these two class horses have taken control of their drivers two weeks apart. I don't believe it. The Red Army took on the Black and White army in Brisbane and have now turned their attention to the Blue and Green Army. Pesonally I love the competition but truthfully someone is going to lose. I am not sure who but can't wait to find out.

[Toohard]

Andrew Bensley - Trotting: Luke McCarthy has been given 6 week suspension for an unacceptable drive on Excel Stride*@TabcorpMenangleSat night. Starts Oct 23

[Pena]

Exhibit 1 In Appeal - 28/9/13 Menangle Race 7.
It seems that Lauren is becoming the new Koala Bear of the industry.
Luke is a morale to get off on appeal.

[Messenger]

Exhibit 1 In Appeal - 28/9/13 Menangle Race 7.
It seems that Lauren is becoming the new Koala Bear of the industry.
Luke is a morale to get off on appeal.
I would think he would NOT want that as an exhibit at all - for then his drive screams of payback

[Triple V]

Andrew Bensley - Trotting: Luke McCarthy has been given 6 week suspension for an unacceptable drive on Excel Stride*@TabcorpMenangleSat night. Starts Oct 23

[VVV] IMO that's a VERY inconsistent approach by the Stewards.
As I have already said in another Forum, if they view such efforts in a bad light then they either jam BOTH Lauren & Luke up for their respective drives (Lauren 2 weeks ago on Suave Stuey Lombo AND Luke on Saturday night with Excel Stride) or the let BOTH slide.

[ScabsCat]

[VVV] IMO that's a VERY inconsistent approach by the Stewards.
As I have already said in another Forum, if they view such efforts in a bad light then they either jam BOTH Lauren & Luke up for their respective drives (Lauren 2 weeks ago on Suave Stuey Lombo AND Luke on Saturday night with Excel Stride) or the let BOTH slide.

Jamie, never a truer word has been spoken! Spot on

[german]

Exhibit 1 In Appeal - 28/9/13 Menangle Race 7.
It seems that Lauren is becoming the new Koala Bear of the industry.
Luke is a morale to get off on appeal.

Luke is no moral to get off on appeal. Dont kid yourself, he has absolutely no chance he may as well not even appeal. He shouldn't have got 6 weeks i agree totally it was incorrect he should have received 6 months!!! What he did was a discrace on the trotting industry, they should have called him in and cut up his licence. Excel Stride wasn't pulling Luke was chassing it up to lay the pressure on he gave his horse no chance of winning. Some trotting people in a weird world watch the replay no the race no the horses it was clear as day a tactical drive to help the stable mate and intern bury the leader. Pretty simple i repeat again Luke Mcarthy a discrace! No wonder the trots in NSW are going down hill with the main stable having to turn to these tactics with a champion like Excel Stride.

[Pena]

This drive was no worse than the Suave Stuey drive. Although the 47kg girl seems to be an acceptable excuse. Well it doesn't cut it with me. If Reid Sanders and his team want to take the hard line position then go for it, but just be consistent. In 3 weeks Panella had two incidents of not being able to hold a horse "APPARENTLY", with the COT drive on Longtan Luke and the Suave Stuey. Penalty - ZERO. When you see people like Adam Francis getting 6 weeks for I am still not sure why, there definitely seems to be a massive bias towards the new golden girl of harness racing.

[mango]

Hi Jack

Would have to agree with you totally, just watched all drives again on the horses you have mentioned and can't understand how Luke get's time and Lauren not a thing. I would like to know what the stewards see different in those races to what i'm looking at. In know way am I having a go at Lauren as I think she is doing a great job but in saying that if she apparently can't hold certain horse's maybe she should not be driving them.

[ScabsCat]

There have been a lot of curious decisions by stewards in recent months. I can think back to August 10 when the now infamous "Mister Chow" race occurred. Ashlee receives a 6 week suspension for going to the rear and disappearing at the horses previous start, then on August 10, Mister McRooney a noted leader hands the lead up to Mister Chow who leads from barrier 5. No COT on either horse, Mister Chow is backed into even money after it's "disappointing" run the week before. And not a question asked by the Stipes. I believe that to be the moment harness racing took a turn for the worse in NSW.

[Boydy]

I am a massive advocate for the removal of the Change of Tactics rule.

To start with I do not believe that the rule helps the everyday punter in the TAB it only helps the professinal punter. The rule takes away any initiative and can lead to uncompetitive racing especially when a favourite going further forward.

The sooner the rule is scraped the better. It amazes me that the participants don't take action through their representative to get rid of the rule as I have never spoken to anyone that thinks the rule is either good for the sport or the participants.

[ScabsCat]

I agree Boydy, you either have to police it fully or get rid of the rule. I don't think it was simply an oversight on August 10 however.

[Pena]

Dallas, the facts are any fair minded person can see the Suave Stuey drive and the Excel drives were almost identical and produced the same result both horses sets of horses getting beaten 30+ metres. In each circumstance both drivers gave their horses no chance of winning. Adam said in one of his previous posts his horse has always won from the front, but Adam Mach Beauty has never been subject to a 26.9 second quarter. By holding in this instance MB had no hope, particularly being first up.
On the rules of racing, if a race is run too slow the driver of the leader gets fined. If the race is run too fast the driver in the death gets suspended. Does any one find this strange???
I am sure glad that my livelyhood does not depend on the current rules of harness racing.

[Toohard]

Hi Jack

Would have to agree with you totally, just watched all drives again on the horses you have mentioned and can't understand how Luke get's time and Lauren not a thing. I would like to know what the stewards see different in those races to what i'm looking at.

Gday Dallas

I agree. Maybe the times had something to do with it. They went 1.55 in SSL race. Ideal Scott went 1.56 same night. C3-c5 1.56 too.

Saturday night 1.50. And (I'm not suggesting anything!) the stablemate won Saturday night.

[german]

I am a massive advocate for the removal of the Change of Tactics rule.

To start with I do not believe that the rule helps the everyday punter in the TAB it only helps the professinal punter. The rule takes away any initiative and can lead to uncompetitive racing especially when a favourite going further forward.

The sooner the rule is scraped the better. It amazes me that the participants don't take action through their representative to get rid of the rule as I have never spoken to anyone that thinks the rule is either good for the sport or the participants.

The rule COT is one of the best rules in the industry. If your betting on harness racing yu have every right to know whether the driver or trainer has decided to vary there tactics. I don't want then going forward one day and back on another willy nilly!!! They should always have to declare if the are changing tactics or else we would have cowboys doing watevaaaa they like going back one week sitting 4br pulling horses up then spearing to the front the next week. By the way without professional punters you would need the COT rule cause the drivers would be racing for 200bucks prize money! Punters deserve to know there the reason the drivers have a job! Don't forget that

[german]

Dallas, the facts are any fair minded person can see the Suave Stuey drive and the Excel drives were almost identical and produced the same result both horses sets of horses getting beaten 30+ metres. In each circumstance both drivers gave their horses no chance of winning. Adam said in one of his previous posts his horse has always won from the front, but Adam Mach Beauty has never been subject to a 26.9 second quarter. By holding in this instance MB had no hope, particularly being first up.
On the rules of racing, if a race is run too slow the driver of the leader gets fined. If the race is run too fast the driver in the death gets suspended. Does any one find this strange???
I am sure glad that my livelyhood does not depend on the current rules of harness racing.

The drives were kind of similar except suave stuey limbo attempted to find the lead but couldn't so sat up Mach stride actually ran along down the back straight I'm not sure why people are suggesting stuey attacked he didn't he was half a metre behind Luke was the one running along, it should also be noted stuey had previously been leading and running along so sitting in the death attempting to run along would have been acceptable. Now MB a known leader was never handing up, Excel stride is not known and has barely if ever attacked in the 2nd and 3rd qtr and attacked a horse which freely runs along in front he beat option anyway would of been to sit on MB who would of still run along and then Excel stride could have his chance to come off his back in straight and as we know MB would have run time and being first up Excel would have got his chance. In doing wat Luke did his option was not to sit outside MB and win his option was clearly to bury MB with no thought of winning himself. The week before Lauren still had thoughts of trying to win! That is the difference here Lauren attempted to win on stuey Luke made no attempt to win just to bury and help his stable mate... Like I said he should have got 6 months!!!

[Triple V]

I agree Boydy, you either have to police it fully or get rid of the rule. I don't think it was simply an oversight on August 10 however.


[VVV] If the rule remains in place then not only must they police it fully but they must police it accurately & police it in the spirit with which the rule was first instituted. It's going back a little bit however in what was nothing short of a classic piece of Keystone Cops style slapstick...I can vividly recall former NSW Chief Steward Bill Cable quite bloodymindedly fining Luke McCarthy when driving Roman Stride for snagging off the gate and coming with one late go at them to win the race.
It apparently mattered not that Roman Stride, the short priced fav, won the race exactly BECAUSE of the fact Luke snagged off the gate instead of adopting his customary style of leaving for the front & duly becoming involved in an early burn with at least a trio of other fast beginners drawn to his inside. All that apparently mattered to Bill & his Panel was that he was 'not driven as per normal'.
The inescapable fact that had he been driven as per normal, the short priced fav. would almost certainly have gone down & the COT rule would have in fact served to defeat its own purpose by way of dudding the Punters on said short price fav. who's interests it was designed to protect, well...it apparently never crossed their minds. Honestly. WTF????? The COT rule is an absolute abomination & it should be dispensed with immediately if not sooner.

[Triple V]

I am a massive advocate for the removal of the Change of Tactics rule.

To start with I do not believe that the rule helps the everyday punter in the TAB it only helps the professinal punter. The rule takes away any initiative and can lead to uncompetitive racing especially when a favourite going further forward.

The sooner the rule is scraped the better. It amazes me that the participants don't take action through their representative to get rid of the rule as I have never spoken to anyone that thinks the rule is either good for the sport or the participants.

[VVV] Could not agree more.

[Richard prior]

Got to agree with Boydy and VVV, Get rid of the rule and make racing more interesting for the fans and the everyday punter. As I mentioned in an earlier post, There's nothing worse than seeing a $1.10 pop just roll around and win as it pleases. I'm sure the big punters would disagree, But I'm sure that racing would be a greater spectacle if you didn't have to disclose your tactics and the chance of backing a winner at longer odds would certainly come into play and would increase turnover.

[german]

Im not sure how people believe taking away the COT rule will help you back longer price winners and ill tell you 100% taking away the COT will only make turnover decrese thats for sure. What are you under the belief punters will bet more not knowing what is gong on and just hope for the best. The turnover is already low on say Menanglke harness on a Tues or Saturday and say the pool is 20 k it will drop 5K per race on some races with no COT rule in place. for the person who said roman stride was 1.10 and was snagged of the gate and Luke received a fine he received the fine for not letting stewards know of his intentions to restrain at the start as the horse normally goes forward. You said if he went forward he may have cost him the race well the COT rule didnt cost him the race, he is allowed to go back at the start but he should of clarrified that before restraining. All punters are benefited my the COT rule it allows you to have a better understanding of how the race will be run and keeps fairness in the game as without it you can basically do as you like. Pulling horses up would become stock standard going back to last for 3 weeks then charging to the front the next week... sure that will entice people to bet...

[Triple V]

Until such time as the big punters (whom the COT rule was brought in to placate) decide to step up & contribute towards service fees, agistment, feed, Vet & Training bills...they can go and slam right up their respective fundamentals...vigorously, hard & sideways...that which they have totally erroneously come to see as their God given 'right' to know exactly what an Owner's horse may or may not be doing when the arms of the Mobile Barrier fold back.

[Hollie]

Maorisidol. I think that For A Reason, or Frank the Tank if I remember correctly is an absolute champion. To come back from what happened to him and run a time like that was just crazy! Lets just hope he can keep those times going until the Miracle Mile and then that will be a very exciting race! Because I personally cant wait til this champion goes up against some of the old and new!! I just don't know what story would be better. Mat's Miracle or if he was to win a race like the Mile.

[german]

Maorisidol. I think that For A Reason, or Frank the Tank if I remember correctly is an absolute champion. To come back from what happened to him and run a time like that was just crazy! Lets just hope he can keep those times going until the Miracle Mile and then that will be a very exciting race! Because I personally cant wait til this champion goes up against some of the old and new!! I just don't know what story would be better. Mat's Miracle or if he was to win a race like the Mile.

I like ur enthusiasm but please... For a reason will not get an invite for the miracle mile it ran on good race off a farcically run race! Well done on winning but if you look who was running on with him Mr Prezly yeah there's a miracle mile candidate not!

[german]

Maorisidol. I think that For A Reason, or Frank the Tank if I remember correctly is an absolute champion. To come back from what happened to him and run a time like that was just crazy! Lets just hope he can keep those times going until the Miracle Mile and then that will be a very exciting race! Because I personally cant wait til this champion goes up against some of the old and new!! I just don't know what story would be better. Mat's Miracle or if he was to win a race like the Mile.
I understand your point but unfortunately without the big punters you wouldn't have vet bills and feed and adjistment, you wouldn't be racing well maybe for hay bails. I think people fail to realise the big punters keep trainers and drivers in a job that's how it is. And what are you saying owners should be shifty aNd not declare what they are doing? All the COT is asking for is to keep the sport fair if you normally lead and your going back you should say so keep the racing fair and just. No one wants some cowboy going back one week and forward another

[Hollie]

I like ur enthusiasm but please... For a reason will not get an invite for the miracle mile it ran on good race off a farcically run race! Well done on winning but if you look who was running on with him Mr Prezly yeah there's a miracle mile candidate not!


Well if you take a look at Mr Presleys last two races, you wouldn't rule him out to be entering the lead up races. Sure he was following for a reason up and was beat by twenty metres. But remember that F.A.R did run 1:50 flat and I know that that may not have happened if Luke didn't drive Excel the way that he did, but that doesn't mean that either of these horses wouldn't have run the races that they did. You have to give these two horses some credit. It will be tough for them to even get near the Mile, but I am not ruling either of them out. If you don't think that way, then that doesn't worry me.

[Hollie]

I like ur enthusiasm but please... For a reason will not get an invite for the miracle mile it ran on good race off a farcically run race! Well done on winning but if you look who was running on with him Mr Prezly yeah there's a miracle mile candidate not!


I know that it would be tough for either of them to even get a shot at the miracle mile but you don't rule them out because of the status. F.A.R may have only run one race in that time, but he is only three runs back. Hell, if he ran that time I wonder what Beautide is capable of. All that I can say is that we don't see times like that everyday and I know that it may not have been like that if they didn't go hard at the start, but they still did run that time. Its not like them horses don't just sit there they still have to run trying to keep up with the front horses. I am saying that I am not ruling them out of being contenders in the lead ups, but I don't care if anyone doesn't feel the same.

[Hollie]

I like ur enthusiasm but please... For a reason will not get an invite for the miracle mile it ran on good race off a farcically run race! Well done on winning but if you look who was running on with him Mr Prezly yeah there's a miracle mile candidate not!


I know that it would be tough for either of them to even get a shot at the miracle mile but you don't rule them out because of the status. F.A.R may have only run one race in that time, but he is only three runs back. Hell, if he ran that time I wonder what Beautide is capable of. All that I can say is that we don't see times like that everyday and I know that it may not have been like that if they didn't go hard at the start, but they still did run that time. Its not like them horses don't just sit there they still have to run trying to keep up with the front horses. I am saying that I am not ruling them out of being contenders in the lead ups, but I don't care if anyone doesn't feel the same.

[broco]

funny thing is the "professional punters" got on just fine without the COT rule before, its a load of bull and takes all initiative out of a drive, when all plans go to hell in a hand basket because we are driving stock with a complete mind of their own the last thing that goes through a drivers mind is "oh shit better drive the brains out of our horse to get up there cause that's what we told the punters we would do" most look after their horse first, after all without them the punters wouldn't be betting on anything they would have to go out and find something else to fill their day/night with.
Great run from For A Reason, even how the race was run he still had to run it to win it and he didn't just win it he bolted it in

[Richard prior]

Marty, I think that your overlooking the fact that For A Reason is only the 2nd horse in the Southern Hemisphere to win in 1.50. I think that he would be a perfect candidate for 1 of the lead up races to the Miracle mile. If he holds together and comes out and wins the race in a similar time, He would definitely get an Invite. I think that it was a great run last Saturday night and the race was really run truly as the speed was on all the way and he just let go and streeted the opposition. It's a real pity that there's so much controversy surrounding the race. In North America the FFA races are run like this everyday and that's why they consistently run times of 1.50 or faster.

[Toohard]

funny thing is the "professional punters" got on just fine without the COT rule before, its a load of bull and takes all initiative out of a drive, when all plans go to hell in a hand basket because we are driving stock with a complete mind of their own the last thing that goes through a drivers mind is "oh shit better drive the brains out of our horse to get up there cause that's what we told the punters we would do" most look after their horse first, after all without them the punters wouldn't be betting on anything they would have to go out and find something else to fill their day/night with.


Well said!!!

[ScabsCat]

Marty, I think that your overlooking the fact that For A Reason is only the 2nd horse in the Southern Hemisphere to win in 1.50. I think that he would be a perfect candidate for 1 of the lead up races to the Miracle mile. If he holds together and comes out and wins the race in a similar time, He would definitely get an Invite. I think that it was a great run last Saturday night and the race was really run truly as the speed was on all the way and he just let go and streeted the opposition. It's a real pity that there's so much controversy surrounding the race. In North America the FFA races are run like this everyday and that's why they consistently run times of 1.50 or faster.

Oh dear Richard....I hope you are being facetious

[Maorisidol]

ScabsCat, do you think it is possible for a horse to "fluke" a time of 1:50? I stand to be corrected, but isn't that the second fastest winning race time EVER in Australia???? he was a bees knee from being only the second horse downunder to run in 1:49 and change!
If that race had Smoken Up out front running ballistic times (as they did in the race last week) and FAR was sitting exactly where he was is there any reason why he wouldnt have done the same thing????
A time is a time, yes the leaders cut themselves and couldnt sustain the pace (unlike Smoken Up) and capitulated, but i'm sure FAR actually ran 1609 metres and his time was 1:50, i dont remember him joining in at the 600!
This means he has the ability, the speed , the endurance, the skill to run an amazing time no matter how you may think he was gifted the race...
Again as the point of starting this thread was, hopefully we can see a great "story" of him going on with that effort and proving to me and you that he has come back so very well and further goes on to fulfill his potential he promised as a young horse. The Trots needs another challenger in our top ranks, i believe we are a bit thin in depth in Australia at that end, with IMTQ, Smoken Up (nearing the end) Bitobliss???? (still has to put together 2-3 mores runs similar to last and do it against Quinn, and the kiwis), I'm Victorious (same proof needs to be cemented this summer) Excel Stride (still not in the Blacky Mr F category) and CBlaster. So, i reckon we need some great new blood and lets hope for the sport and for the horses sake he continues, cos that little Christen Me is gonna spank every Australian horse going in the next couple of years from what i can see!

[ScabsCat]

I suppose only time will tell if FAR is the real deal or not. My point is that I just don't like races being run that way. By all means put as much pressure on up front as you want, but don't then drop out and finish behind the ambulance. Excel Stride was first up, its going to take a lot to recover from that run.

[Boydy]

Marty, I'm afraid the punters vs owners story is a bit like the chicken and the egg story, neither would be doing with out each other although spending a night at Maitland you realise that there is a core group of trainers/drivers that would do it even if they were racing for ribbons. The facts are however anyone who puts their hand in their pocket to buy and race a horse are certainly not doing it to get rich.

The thing that I object to most is that if you follow the form you should have a good idea where your horse is going to land in a race, you don't need to be told. If there is a race with a number of horses with gate speed and you think you might take a sit and when the gate moves away the speed isn't as hot as you think it was going to be. I want my driver going forward. But if they had to commit before the race and are oblidged to go back even if it means they are not giving your horse the best chance they are tied to a pre race commitment. Think about that, driving a horse so it does not have its best chance of winning because you fear being suspended because you said you were going back. It is crazy!!!

Geulph led in the 1000 guineas yesterday for the first time and the jockey was praised for showing iniative. Change of Tactics is by far the worst rule in harness racing.

[Boydy]

I agree with you Moaris. Very few horses can run 1:50 even in time trials with galloping pacemakers. If a horse is capable of running that time, it has to be a certain invitee.

[german]

Marty, I'm afraid the punters vs owners story is a bit like the chicken and the egg story, neither would be doing with out each other although spending a night at Maitland you realise that there is a core group of trainers/drivers that would do it even if they were racing for ribbons. The facts are however anyone who puts their hand in their pocket to buy and race a horse are certainly not doing it to get rich.

The thing that I object to most is that if you follow the form you should have a good idea where your horse is going to land in a race, you don't need to be told. If there is a race with a number of horses with gate speed and you think you might take a sit and when the gate moves away the speed isn't as hot as you think it was going to be. I want my driver going forward. But if they had to commit before the race and are oblidged to go back even if it means they are not giving your horse the best chance they are tied to a pre race commitment. Think about that, driving a horse so it does not have its best chance of winning because you fear being suspended because you said you were going back. It is crazy!!!

Geulph led in the 1000 guineas yesterday for the first time and the jockey was praised for showing iniative. Change of Tactics is by far the worst rule in harness racing.

I understand what you are saying. COT does not mean you have to 100% do as you have advised its if circumstances permit. If you say you will be driven further back and you go forward as a result of there being no speed this will be acceptable by the stewards. You will notice some drivers to submit driven further forward if circumstances permit. Driven further back if circumstances permit. The rule is mainly used for horses which lead at all cost then decide they will not be going forward. The rule does need to be policed correctly as well.

[german]

For a Reason will not be invited to the Miracle mile and will be lucky to finish in the top 3 at his next start in a group race or similar. For the person who said he didnt just join in at the 600. Actually he did exactly that he sat back waited for his bro to bury MB then he popped out and ran 600metres!when the damage had been done.

[Boydy]

You obviously miss the point Marty he still covered the distance in 1:50.

Plenty of horses take a sit of a hot speed and can't run 1:50 he could have won by a metre and gone 1:51.8

[Danno]

Until such time as the big punters (whom the COT rule was brought in to placate) decide to step up & contribute towards service fees, agistment, feed, Vet & Training bills...they can go and slam right up their respective fundamentals...vigorously, hard & sideways...that which they have totally erroneously come to see as their God given 'right' to know exactly what an Owner's horse may or may not be doing when the arms of the Mobile Barrier fold back.

Not many times Jamie and I agree completely, but this is one of them!

[Maorisidol]

You obviously miss the point Marty he still covered the distance in 1:50.

Plenty of horses take a sit of a hot speed and can't run 1:50 he could have won by a metre and gone 1:51.8

Thanku Boydy, its not that hard really...i understand partially his thoughts on why his opinion is what it is based on the way the race was run, but, yes the time is the time. He did run 1609, not 600...

[Chariots]

The COT rule will always be subject to conjecture. I don't agree with this god given right for owners to decide on a significant change of tactics and not tell anyone either. I am pretty sure that owners would not be racing for ribbons if the punters weren't funding the stake money. Having said that the other big financial contributors are the owners and without both there would be no industry. Getting the right balance is the key factor.

[Boydy]

Maori I think he misses the point that sheer speed is something that can't be replicated. The winner last year didn't run as fast on the back of a fast speed, granted not as fast as last Saturday night but that is the mystic of the Miracle Mile.

There have been plenty of unusual choices in the MM in the past but if a horse has run 1:50 the fastest time for a number of years I would invite him. I really think this Miracle Mile has all the attributes of an intriguing if the right horses get there.

[Danno]

The COT rule will always be subject to conjecture. I don't agree with this god given right for owners to decide on a significant change of tactics and not tell anyone either. I am pretty sure that owners would not be racing for ribbons if the punters weren't funding the stake money. Having said that the other big financial contributors are the owners and without both there would be no industry. Getting the right balance is the key factor.

Ray, just for a moment understand that there are other competitors in your race, now just for a moment think about the advantage they have knowing what your tactics are at the start, and possibly further into the race.......now think about the possibility of everyone knowing EXACTLY what everyone else is saying they are intending to do........the whole thing then becomes completely contrary to a fair contest!!!!! do punters want a fair contest? I suspect so, but there are punters who want to know exactly whats going on so they can play the numbers at the expense of the innocent punters who "play for chance".

I think you will find the people pushing for the COT rule are those punters afforementioned....those that want more certanty, rather than a fair contest.

[german]

Ray, just for a moment understand that there are other competitors in your race, now just for a moment think about the advantage they have knowing what your tactics are at the start, and possibly further into the race.......now think about the possibility of everyone knowing EXACTLY what everyone else is saying they are intending to do........the whole thing then becomes completely contrary to a fair contest!!!!! do punters want a fair contest? I suspect so, but there are punters who want to know exactly whats going on so they can play the numbers at the expense of the innocent punters who "play for chance".

I think you will find the people pushing for the COT rule are those punters afforementioned....those that want more certanty, rather than a fair contest.

So a FAIR contest would just be restraining for 3 weekes then bursting out to the lead the next week... real fair. Drivers are not telling of every tactic all they are asked to do is let people know if they intend to drive there horse in a different manner to it is usually driven. I see nothing wrong with that. It lets evryone know pro punters and average guessers to a change in the drive of a certain horse which does not normally adopt those tactics! Cot of tactics also helps other drivers who may have been thnking they will lead and then see there is a COT and therefore they may now wish to take a sit instead of being buried themselves allowing them to take a trail knowing say the Fav will now be going further forward. Everyone wins. I guess the smarter people benefit in the end who know the form. If your putting more work into the form you deserve to know more and win more thatn someone who just rolls up and takes a guess! If you want to win more do more form.

[eliteblood]

So a FAIR contest would just be restraining for 3 weekes then bursting out to the lead the next week... real fair. Drivers are not telling of every tactic all they are asked to do is let people know if they intend to drive there horse in a different manner to it is usually driven. I see nothing wrong with that. It lets evryone know pro punters and average guessers to a change in the drive of a certain horse which does not normally adopt those tactics! Cot of tactics also helps other drivers who may have been thnking they will lead and then see there is a COT and therefore they may now wish to take a sit instead of being buried themselves allowing them to take a trail knowing say the Fav will now be going further forward. Everyone wins. I guess the smarter people benefit in the end who know the form. If your putting more work into the form you deserve to know more and win more thatn someone who just rolls up and takes a guess! If you want to win more do more form.

So should the other drivers then be required to advise a COT in this circumstance.
Why not just get all the drivers together before the race and work out who is going to be where and what each driver will do during the race and then have it broadcast over sky so that everyone can back the winner?

It is the driver's job to try and win the race, making pre-race plans in response to barrier draws etc. and then making split decisions as the race unfolds, in response to other drivers tactics, the pace of the race, where they have settled in the field, etc., etc. Good drivers are the one's who do that well. Punters know who they are and also who the bad drivers are, it is reflected in the odds, and it is an important consideration in their betting decision.
It is the stewards job to ensure that the decisions made by the drivers are reasonable in terms of the objective of giving the horse the best opportunity to win the race. The race should not be regulated any more than that IMO.

[aussiebreno]

Could you imagine Andrew Johns telling his opposition, were going to run this play where I throw a cut out ball to the winger, so make sure your defence is aware of what is going to happen.

[Boydy]

Marty, I guess from what your saying is you only need to advise if you intend to drive differently. So by default if you are driving the same the other already know what you are doing, so the COT rule allows the opposition to know what you are doing all the time!!! If the stewards see that a driver/trainer has just been giving a horse a run they still have the powers to charge them for not giving their horse every chance retrospectively.

When I see a stewards report and I read COT and driven accordingly it makes me scream. I would rather see that the driver is asked after the race and he explains the reasons why the horse was driven differently it would show who knows how to read a race and form and who doesnt.

[broco]

marty I would love to see you in a drivers seat instead of the bar stool or couch in front of the tv, I think you would soon change you mind on how the COT rule works and what you can and cant do once you have stated you will be going further back or forwards or whatever, you can do all the form you want on paper but once you are out there with 2 ribbons of pvc covered webbing controlling half a tonne of horse flesh with a mind of its own, you use your brain and your experience to get the job done to the best of your horses ability, the only thing change of tactics does is make you think twice about taking an opportunity that presents itself because its not what you said you would do, a good driver gives their horses every chance every start we certainly cant afford not to, the races are worth peanuts (unless your blessed with a top liner) compared to the feed bills and the only times our owners get something back for the dollars they put in is when you pro punters doubt the ability of their horses and they lob up at big odds and with their miserable $25 each way they take the cash from your odds on favourites, yes racing needs the turn over but not at the cost of fair and smart racing where the horses come first and the punters a long way behind them.
And as for FAR's 1.50 it doesn't matter where he sat in the race he still had to run the time, if he couldn't run it he wouldn't have finished where he did he would have ran the time he was capable of and finished wherever, its the same as you have a horse who can only run 2.00 it doesn't matter where he is in a race if they run 1.58 he cant win it, it up to his driver to rate the race to a time he can win it in, but if you have no common knowledge from being out there and doing it yourself well you cant expect to gain any watching from the comfort of your tv screen wherever it may be

[broncobrad]

No-one remember Baby Blings Miracle Mile? In my book For A Reason gets the first invite...pacemaker in the race or not!

[Richard prior]

Brad, Totally agree, He's proven he can run 1.50 and I think he won with a little in the tank. Still a lot to like about Smoken Up, If he's in the field, A fast pace is a definite. I would invite Baby Bling back as the defending champ as she's running into form. Bitobliss is an excitement machine and he would be finishing strongly off a fast pace. Christen Me is a moral for the race and he could possibly be 1 of the best horses we've ever seen in this part of the world. Terror to Love is a great horse over longer distances and I'm yet to be convinced that he's a genuine mile horse, although he did run 1.51 on Jewels day. It's a real pity that Quinny is injured as it would just about be the greatest MM ever with him in the field. If the conditions are right, A sub 1.50 time is definitely on the cards.

[broncobrad]

Like I said before...For A Reason gets the first invite...without all the conspiracy crap! Go you good thing!

[p plater]

Like I said before...For A Reason gets the first invite...without all the conspiracy crap! Go you good thing!

No doubt about it on that run.

[Maorisidol]

For a Reason will not be invited to the Miracle mile and will be lucky to finish in the top 3 at his next start in a group race or similar. For the person who said he didnt just join in at the 600. Actually he did exactly that he sat back waited for his bro to bury MB then he popped out and ran 600metres!when the damage had been done.

Doh! Bugger! Oops!
At what point did he join into the race tonite German?
I believe that proves his last run was no fluke, and there we have it the first horse in the MM...
He now holds the second fastest race mile winning time, and the third fastest race winning time in Australian history along with now being the second horse to ever win under 1:50.
1:49.4 wins by 19.3m

[Greg Hando]

Wholly agree,1.49.4 to finish like that coming off the pace simply outstanding. When is Lauren Panella going to wake up and drive Mach Beauty with a sit , heaps of pace and ability but is getting killed driven like this, he will never do well in the GC driving him this way.

[doinmabest]

Miracle Mile Conditions
The conditions for the Miracle Mile are as follows:
(a) At the discretion of the Board of Directors the reigning Miracle Mile
winner would be issued an invitation based on current form however if
connections accepted the invitation the horse would be permitted to
contest only one automatic invitation event. The decision on an invitation
would be made prior to the close of nominations for the Newcastle Mile;
(b) The winner of the Newcastle Mile would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile however would not be permitted to contest
another automatic invitation event;
(c) At the discretion of the Board of Directors further invitations may be
issued prior to the close of nominations for the Coca Cola Sprint however
those invitations would be restricted to horses which faced the difficulties of
travel which may affect their performance in the Miracle Mile if compelled to
compete in an automatic invitation event. Those horses however if accepting
an invitation would not be permitted to contest an automatic invitation event;
(d) The winner of the Coca Cola Sprint would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile however would not be permitted to contest a
further automatic invitation event (Cordina Sprint);
(e) The winner of the Cordina Sprint would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile;
(f) The remainder of the field would be invited at the sole discretion of
the Board of Directors following the Cordina Sprint taking into consideration
only those horses which contested the Coca Cola Sprint and the Cordina
Sprint;
(g) The minimum field size would remain at six (6) horses whilst the
maximum field size would be restricted to eight (8) horses with two reserves
drawn in the barriers.
John Dumesny
Chief Executive
Does he have to run in the qualifiers?????

[Greg Hando]

Miracle Mile Conditions
The conditions for the Miracle Mile are as follows:
(a) At the discretion of the Board of Directors the reigning Miracle Mile
winner would be issued an invitation based on current form however if
connections accepted the invitation the horse would be permitted to
contest only one automatic invitation event. The decision on an invitation
would be made prior to the close of nominations for the Newcastle Mile;
(b) The winner of the Newcastle Mile would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile however would not be permitted to contest
another automatic invitation event;
(c) At the discretion of the Board of Directors further invitations may be
issued prior to the close of nominations for the Coca Cola Sprint however
those invitations would be restricted to horses which faced the difficulties of
travel which may affect their performance in the Miracle Mile if compelled to
compete in an automatic invitation event. Those horses however if accepting
an invitation would not be permitted to contest an automatic invitation event;
(d) The winner of the Coca Cola Sprint would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile however would not be permitted to contest a
further automatic invitation event (Cordina Sprint);
(e) The winner of the Cordina Sprint would automatically receive an
invitation to the Miracle Mile;
(f) The remainder of the field would be invited at the sole discretion of
the Board of Directors following the Cordina Sprint taking into consideration
only those horses which contested the Coca Cola Sprint and the Cordina
Sprint;
(g) The minimum field size would remain at six (6) horses whilst the
maximum field size would be restricted to eight (8) horses with two reserves
drawn in the barriers.
John Dumesny
Chief Executive
Does he have to run in the qualifiers?????

Going by that Fred you would think he would have to.

[aussiebreno]

Wowee!

[doinmabest]

That's my take on it too Greg....

[The Escape Club]

Loved Beautide's run tonight too. Looked like he may have locked wheels coming into the straight while Brave Wiggy was skipping away. Very impressive.

[littlelenny]

Very Impressive win again only 2nd horse to break 150 you would think he gets an invite to the MM.

[Richard prior]

For a Reason even more impressive this week and had a bit in the tank again. He is more than capable of going even faster on that run. It's great to see a colonial bred stallion run times like this and when he finishes his racing career this time, breeders should give him a lot of consideration. He's got a lot on his resume already being a Derby winner at 3, has come back from a career ending injury and is running phenomenal times as a FFA pacer. The beauty about FAR is that we are seeing him strutting his stuff here in the flesh and being a son of the mighty Art Major from a Fake left mare he certainly has a lot of appeal, Speed, Guts and pedigree and it would be great to keep the money in the local industry instead of sending it to North America.

[german]

Maybe I was a little wrong it was a pretty impressive run yet again off the back of a 55 first half. And he did only join it at the 400. I'm sure he will be very hard to beat if within striking distance And gets cler running in the M.M

[Richard prior]

Marty, Good on you for admitting that you might have been wrong. If I was a punting man, I'd be at the TAB as soon as the fixed odds come out and be having a wager on FAR. At this stage he's definitely the number 1 chance amongst the Aussie brigade.

[Boydy]

Marty, maybe you should change 'a little" with "TOTALLY".

Won't run in the first 3 in his next start - WRONG!!

Won't get invited to the Miracle Mile - Yet to be proven but "WRONG"

Didn't need his little bro to help him out this time.

Like I said previously, only a handful of horses in the southern hemisphere can physically run 1:50.

Any horse that has recently run it should be straight in.

[Toohard]

Like I said previously, only a handful of horses in the southern hemisphere can physically run 1:50.

Any horse that has recently run it should be straight in.

He didn't just fall in either. Won by 20ms. My calcs say he going 14.7ms a second. Won by 20m so none of the other runners got close to breaking 1.50. Can't do it when race run like that, they can't do it. Reckon there's a heap around can run a 55 (or less) half. 2 consecutive 55 (or less) halves, wouldn't be many. Wouldn't matter where they were sitting in run or when they joined in.

Probably never know. That 2nd quarter at Menangle nearly always run in around 30 secs. No real chance breaking 1.50 if that the case.

I'm with you. If it's the race for the fastest horses, he's straight in.

PS- T-RIFFIC call Fred!!

[Maorisidol]

Maybe I was a little wrong it was a pretty impressive run yet again off the back of a 55 first half. And he did only join it at the 400. I'm sure he will be very hard to beat if within striking distance And gets cler running in the M.M

German, please expand on "he did only join it at the 400."
I just don't understand your thinking on that concept...
I understand how you got that impression his run before but after doing what he did this time I really don't get what u r meaning if it's relevant to this sub 1:50

[p plater]

German, please expand on "he did only join it at the 400."
I just don't understand your thinking on that concept...
I understand how you got that impression his run before but after doing what he did this time I really don't get what u r meaning if it's relevant to this sub 1:50

I think he is comparing FOR against a run of Smoken Up who does it at both ends. FOR races like IMQ

[Triple V]

Maybe I was a little wrong it was a pretty impressive run yet again off the back of a 55 first half. And he did only join it at the 400. I'm sure he will be very hard to beat if within striking distance And gets cler running in the M.M


[VVV] A landmark Southern Hemisphere performance, damned with faint praise.

[german]

I have said it was a great run. Although FAR was aided once again my Lauren panella running a 55 sec first half if that does not happen FAR would have been 3br and driven for luck. If you watch the replay he sits quietly on the fence only emerging at the 400 metre markj and commencing a run into the straight. If that was a miracle mie field the death horse would have been able to keep up therefore highly likely there would have been no run. I have said FAR will be a great chance in the MM BUT wiull need to take a cold sit and hope to get a run or receive a hectic pace and hope he can get clear running on the turn and finish off. I think your tunes will change in a race where the sectionals are mpre evenly based in a high quality field where runs arnt presented to Slackas sitting 3br...

[german]

I think he is comparing FOR against a run of Smoken Up who does it at both ends. FOR races like IMQ

Exactly Im the mighty qiuin another tail coat rider needs speed on and races run to suit. He is a champion but needs help in his races. Smokin up a true champion help or no help he wins hands down!

[Messenger]

Marty you need to stop wriggling - your apology would seem to be under extreme duress LOL. No matter what FOR does in the future - he has run 2 brilliant races. And please stop wriggling - IMQ is a champion but you even manage to downgrade this praise by adding that SU is a 'true' champion. LOL
You must be bloody fussy about who you keep in your barn

[Richard prior]

No doubt in my mind there will be a hectic pace and that's exactly what the MM is all about, A speed contest. Some horses just can't hoof it out of the mobile like Smoken Up or a Mach Beauty etc. As far as a cold sit or joining in at the 400 is concerned, the horse must still be running along. FAR has come from behind yes, but he hasn't just fallen over the line, he's bolted in, winning in milestone times. Generally a race that's run at break neck speed is suitable to a horse that's coming from behind and luck in running comes into the equation yes, but it still has a be very good to achieve this. Kev, I think squirming would be a better word.

[Boydy]

Marty, can I please refer your attention to the Miracle Mile run on 28th April 2013. The winner Baby Bling sat 3 pegs. So your theory of being unable to get out is well, quite questionable. You seem to have quite twisted logic. If the leader runs the first half in a Miracle Mile in 58 does that not mean that they are being helped? To question Quinny, well three Interdominions tells me that you way off the mark. Don't forget that the horse coming from the back need to cover more ground than the leader and generally have to negotiate more traffic than the leaders. No doubt Smoken Up is a champion and he may be your favourite but the fact are Quinny is in the same class and certainly Smoken Up is no better.

[Boydy]

As I stated earlier in this post I just hope Beautide gets an invite to the Miracle Mile. It beat For a Reason 3 starts ago and considering that he lost 10-12 metres when he locked wheels on Saturday night his real time was in the 1:50s. Really love the way this horse does his thing, he seems to have an amazing amount of bottom.

[Richard prior]

Beautide very impressive on Saturday night. Great to see a horse from Tassie in the mix.

[german]

Marty you need to stop wriggling - your apology would seem to be under extreme duress LOL. No matter what FOR does in the future - he has run 2 brilliant races. And please stop wriggling - IMQ is a champion but you even manage to downgrade this praise by adding that SU is a 'true' champion. LOL
You must be bloody fussy about who you keep in your barn

Not sure what you mean my wriggling. Ive explained myself. 2 great race both off farcial first halves. When he goes to the fron and runs a sub 150.0 please get back to me

[german]

Marty, can I please refer your attention to the Miracle Mile run on 28th April 2013. The winner Baby Bling sat 3 pegs. So your theory of being unable to get out is well, quite questionable. You seem to have quite twisted logic. If the leader runs the first half in a Miracle Mile in 58 does that not mean that they are being helped? To question Quinny, well three Interdominions tells me that you way off the mark. Don't forget that the horse coming from the back need to cover more ground than the leader and generally have to negotiate more traffic than the leaders. No doubt Smoken Up is a champion and he may be your favourite but the fact are Quinny is in the same class and certainly Smoken Up is no better.

Please...... Baby Bling was gifter the 2013 Miracle mile it is a good FFA horse and that is all.

[Richard prior]

Marty, In your time of watching the Trots, How many mares have been good enough to compete in the FFA ranks and been good enough to win a Group 1 race???? Now we are talking FFA class Group 1 races here, Interdom, MM, New Zealand Cup etc!!

[Messenger]

Not sure what you mean my wriggling. Ive explained myself. 2 great race both off farcial first halves. When he goes to the fron and runs a sub 150.0 please get back to me
Wriggling - as Rich suggested 'squirming' is the word I was looking for. You keep qualifying your praise for horses so that your earlier posts don't seem totally wrong.
In your book, a horse has to be a leader to be a champion. Do you know how ridiculous that is ?
Considering what day it is why don't you apply it to the Melbourne Cup - because it would be flamin ridiculous ! (that Makybe Diva never did it from the front - what a soft winner)

??? I know they were going fast but why didn't Gold Ace ever lock FAR up

[german]

Wriggling - as Rich suggested 'squirming' is the word I was looking for. You keep qualifying your praise for horses so that your earlier posts don't seem totally wrong.
In your book, a horse has to be a leader to be a champion. Do you know how ridiculous that is ?
Considering what day it is why don't you apply it to the Melbourne Cup - because it would be flamin ridiculous ! (that Makybe Diva never did it from the front - what a soft winner)

??? I know they were going fast but why didn't Gold Ace ever lock FAR up

I never once said a horse has to lead to be a champion.

Gold Ace could not keep up that was the reason it didnt put FAR in a pocket. The leader as i have said was running way to quickly. Cant put brains in some drivers who oviously cant read races as well as i can. Your referral to a Melbourne Cup shows what you know maybe you should be at the Melbourne Cup with the otther 100 thousand mug punters who have no idea. Oh and while im here I was tipping Red Cadeux in the Cup maybe Gerald Moose needs a lesson on where the Fence is once again sits 3 wide and took off way to early...

[aussiebreno]

I never once said a horse has to lead to be a champion.

Gold Ace could not keep up that was the reason it didnt put FAR in a pocket. The leader as i have said was running way to quickly. Cant put brains in some drivers who oviously cant read races as well as i can. Your referral to a Melbourne Cup shows what you know maybe you should be at the Melbourne Cup with the otther 100 thousand mug punters who have no idea. Oh and while im here I was tipping Red Cadeux in the Cup maybe Gerald Moose needs a lesson on where the Fence is once again sits 3 wide and took off way to early...
He drew the car park. He would have had to go back to get in. Much harder from back where he would have been. Beaten 11 lengths last start by Volouese de Coeurs. VDC went back and look at the result. Yes unlucky but I doubt many would have got him a spot on fence close enough to be in it at finish.

[aussiebreno]

In more relevance to this thread however, I'm Victorious has been given 1st invite to the mile.

[Boydy]

Marty, your comments are just ridiculous. When Smoken Up went 1 48.5 the first half was run in 53.1 so a 55 first half for high quality horses is nothing exceptional. My comments were not about the quality of Baby Bling but the fact that it sat 3 pegs and won the race from a position you said was impossible to win against good horses. Facts are Baby Bling won the Miracle Mile and that cannot be denied.

[Danno]

I never once said a horse has to lead to be a champion.

Gold Ace could not keep up that was the reason it didnt put FAR in a pocket. The leader as i have said was running way to quickly. Cant put brains in some drivers who oviously cant read races as well as i can. Your referral to a Melbourne Cup shows what you know maybe you should be at the Melbourne Cup with the otther 100 thousand mug punters who have no idea. Oh and while im here I was tipping Red Cadeux in the Cup maybe Gerald Moose needs a lesson on where the Fence is once again sits 3 wide and took off way to early...

I think it's time to get this old number out..............................

The Riders in the Stand

There's some that ride the Robbo style, and bump at every stride;
While others sit a long way back, to get a longer ride.
There's some that ride like sailors do, with legs and arms, and teeth;
And some ride on the horse's neck, and some ride underneath.
But all the finest horsemen out -- the men to Beat the Band --
You'll find amongst the crowd that ride their races in the Stand.
They'll say "He had the race in hand, and lost it in the straight."
They'll show how Godby came too soon, and Barden came too late.
They'll say Chevalley lost his nerve, and Regan lost his head;
They'll tell how one was "livened up" and something else was "dead" --
In fact, the race was never run on sea, or sky, or land,
But what you'd get it better done by riders in the Stand.
The rule holds good in everything in life's uncertain fight;
You'll find the winner can't go wrong, the loser can't go right.
You ride a slashing race, and lose -- by one and all you're banned!
Ride like a bag of flour, and win -- they'll cheer you in the Stand.
Banjo Patterson.

[aussiebreno]

[/B]

I think it's time to get this old number out..............................

The Riders in the Stand

There's some that ride the Robbo style, and bump at every stride;
While others sit a long way back, to get a longer ride.
There's some that ride like sailors do, with legs and arms, and teeth;
And some ride on the horse's neck, and some ride underneath.
But all the finest horsemen out -- the men to Beat the Band --
You'll find amongst the crowd that ride their races in the Stand.
They'll say "He had the race in hand, and lost it in the straight."
They'll show how Godby came too soon, and Barden came too late.
They'll say Chevalley lost his nerve, and Regan lost his head;
They'll tell how one was "livened up" and something else was "dead" --
In fact, the race was never run on sea, or sky, or land,
But what you'd get it better done by riders in the Stand.
The rule holds good in everything in life's uncertain fight;
You'll find the winner can't go wrong, the loser can't go right.
You ride a slashing race, and lose -- by one and all you're banned!
Ride like a bag of flour, and win -- they'll cheer you in the Stand.
Banjo Patterson.
That poems pretty ironic dont cha think. Condemns others for making judgements, but feels as if he can comment whether the rider rode a slashing race and still lost, or rode a plain race and still won. Who is the poet anyway :p

[teecee]

As per the title, this thread it should have been used to celebrate a rare but wonderful achievement in Austalasian Harness racing with the performances of For A Reason.
Whilst the thread was dragged away from its origins in many tangents with people generally expressing fair opinions it has lately degenerated to an unacceptably low level.
Accordingly this thread which should have promised much is now CLOSED