Hall Jnrs demolition derby

[Maorisidol]

Race 1 at Gloucester Park tonite, Hall Jnr is 3 pegs at the winning post at the bell, his horse not seeming to be pulling at all from what I can see all of a sudden pushes the horse outside him out 3wide, they have a little pushing duel, you can see the sulkys wheels on the outside horse being pushed sideways, horse behind are nearly all checked badly, one driver very nearly falls out, he is totally bumped out of his seat, very lucky, another horse gallops after copping check. All this caused by Jnr. I really don't like this person.
What if the driver who nearly got tipped out did get tipped out and was badly injured. Wasn't it only 6 days ago a female jockey was tragically killed in a race fall?
But this is Hall normality.
The man who has been suspended for hitting another driver with a whip cos he wasn't happy with what happened in a race, seems to have little respect or care for other persons and horses safety, "f**k you! I don't care if I push you over or hurt you or your horse! I need to win this race"
Nasty behavior.
Haven't seen driving like that SO blatantly in all of Victoria (apart from Mildura of course with a certain Hall buddy with similar nasty behavior who was also suspended) haven't seen similar driving in NSW or QLD or SA.
Jnr should be proud, he is pretty much one of a kind.
In his own league.
A league that doesn't include the likes of Chris Alford, Gavin Lang, Greg Sugars, D Douglas, McCarthys Dixon and too many others to mention.
Rack up those winners Jnr, set those records in tiny town over there living in your little bubble knowing that a man is also judged on character, Honour, self respect and integrity.

[aussiebreno]

Ah, so that explains why you don't like I'm Themightyquinn! :)

[Maorisidol]

Ah, so that explains why you don't like I'm Themightyquinn! :)

Nuh. Nothin to do with it. Have explained my thoughts/reasons/opinions on ITMQ, that's another thread Brenno.
If Hall drove Trigger or Caribbean Blaster or Dell Boy!!! I wouldn't hate the horse...

[Richard prior]

Ash, Bad Blood between Darryl Douglas and Nathan Jack, have no idea what it's about but they have both been doing some silly things when they have raced each other for a while now. D. Douglas is a class driver and a good bloke and really should be above what ever is going on and concentrate on the job at hand. The young fella is also a very good up and coming driver and should also wake up.

[broncobrad]

Interesting Ash, the stewards comments make no report on how the horse extricated itself from the rails (because obviously it wasn't the drivers fault), but they can certainly identify all of the horses that suffered interference because of it. This is the sort of behaviour that would lend itself to horses being demoted from their placing if stewards had that option to exercise that power, but (a) they don't have it, (b) the bullying tactics would stop and (c) the stewards would have to identify the incident [which in this case hasn't been done].

By comparison Ash as you co-incidently mentioned Dell Boy, last night at Bendigo in the last, I backed Weregonnarock (Manning) that had a cold sit on Dell Boy (Wells) throughout, I thought on face value my horse got beat fair and square and hit the hay. Checked the account this morning and there was more in it than I thought. Checked the results and there was a protest on that race, upheld. Without any head-on vision its hard to define the actual interference, but if Gary Hall made his living in Victoria he would be in jail for life in comparison to what I can only call the slightest of in-fractions by Wells on Dell Boy.

Different scenarios, different stewards, different standards of officialdom...makes me scratch my head (also must buy a lottery ticket after my small and undue windfall), I feel bad for Wells/Dell Boy.

Replay of that race available on this link http://www.harness.org.au/meeting-results.cfm?mc=BN151113&ms=vic#BNC15111310

[Mighty Atom]

I see my post has been removed by an administrator.......fair enough; however in the past any personal attack on a driver, reinsperson or whatever you want to call them has met with an instant rebuke by the panel so how is it they obviously regard Maori's personal slander and vindictive comments regarding Gary Hall Jnr to be valid, an explanation is warranted.

[teecee]

I don't know what it is that people cant distinguish between the issue and the person. This is another example of someone attacking the person rather than the issue so I will try to explain again.
As with numerous other threads supportive or critical of drivers like Luke McCarthy, Glen Douglas, Lauren Panella, Mark Purdon and Shayne Cramp to name a few, this thread is about the issue of their driving be it good, bad or indifferent. Members will have differing views on the ISSUE. They are free to express those views whatever they may be about the ISSUE and other are free to agree or disagree. These forums are full of such discussions. Remember the ISSUE in these cases is the drives of the drivers. As long as nothing defamatory is written which may lead to legal action peoples views of drivers and trainers actions backed up by evidence is fine.


In this case Ash put up an opinion about what he saw as an ISSUE. Others agreed or disagreed. Their opinions of the issue remain on the forum. This is consistent with threads about the other drivers aforementioned.
Unfortunately Rod you saw fit to only attack them personally rather than offer an opinion as to why their opinions on the issue were wrong or at the very least worthy of challenge. Your comment was solely an attack on people from the East coast states of Australia and nothing at all about the issue of G Hall Jr's driving.
If you don't like what someone writes here then ignore it or offer your opinion on why you think their Viewpoint of the ISSUE is wrong.

[Lucky Camilla"s Lovechild]

Well it's not as if this is a one off for this bloke. He has form. I think it says more about the stewards over there, than it does about the drive. I still stand by my comments a while back, that there appears to be rules for some and rules for others. Greg Sugars, Lauren Panella and now Hall Jnr, appear to be teflon coated in my opinion. They were incredibly lucky to recieve very light bans for signifigent interference and unbecoming behaviour recently. The Panella case was just bizare! to recieve as little as she did, after being deemed to act in an intimidary manner towards another driver in a race because she had some big drives coming up over the next few weeks was blatantly wrong.

[Danno]

Interesting Ash, the stewards comments make no report on how the horse extricated itself from the rails (because obviously it wasn't the drivers fault), but they can certainly identify all of the horses that suffered interference because of it. This is the sort of behaviour that would lend itself to horses being demoted from their placing if stewards had that option to exercise that power, but (a) they don't have it, (b) the bullying tactics would stop and (c) the stewards would have to identify the incident [which in this case hasn't been done].

By comparison Ash as you co-incidently mentioned Dell Boy, last night at Bendigo in the last, I backed Weregonnarock (Manning) that had a cold sit on Dell Boy (Wells) throughout, I thought on face value my horse got beat fair and square and hit the hay. Checked the account this morning and there was more in it than I thought. Checked the results and there was a protest on that race, upheld. Without any head-on vision its hard to define the actual interference, but if Gary Hall made his living in Victoria he would be in jail for life in comparison to what I can only call the slightest of in-fractions by Wells on Dell Boy.

Different scenarios, different stewards, different standards of officialdom...makes me scratch my head (also must buy a lottery ticket after my small and undue windfall), I feel bad for Wells/Dell Boy.

Replay of that race available on this link http://www.harness.org.au/meeting-results.cfm?mc=BN151113&ms=vic#BNC15111310

Hey Brad I reckon maybe but some lotto, scratchies, drive up to Qld and get some of their Golden Casket, phone a friend in Vic ( PH) and get him to secure some Tatts ticket as well !!, I have never seen a decision like that in my life!!!!! Makes one think maybe there ought to be an appeal mechanism, 'cos that decision deserves further scrutiny based on what you see on the replay, particularly after seeing the after finish stoush between horse and driver in regards to tractability.

[Mighty Atom]

Sorry teecee, You're the boss but I disagree with your prognosis. I've read many posts with direct attacks on drivers left as is. I had a another comment removed regarding Ricky May's drive in the Auckland Cup earlier this year - all I said was that it was a disgraceful drive and the post was removed. Maorisidol is well known for his constant attacks on WA harness racing, WA horses, Gloucester Park etc but you let him continue unabated. I notice there are very few Western Australian members on this forum and the ones that are rarely comment - if by any chance you may wonder why, you may very well have the answer as above. Unfortunately I think people in the West review this forum as very eastern states egocentric which is a shame.

[p plater]

Rod, I happened to see your post before it was removed. Whilst we expect WA members to be somewhat bias in their comments and fair enough, when you made reference to eastern states Female drivers, you went too far. This is a sport for both sexes and the tone of your comments made me see red on that point. The success of female drivers over in the east can only help the sport in my opinion.

[Maorisidol]

Sorry teecee, You're the boss but I disagree with your prognosis. I've read many posts with direct attacks on drivers left as is. I had a another comment removed regarding Ricky May's drive in the Auckland Cup earlier this year - all I said was that it was a disgraceful drive and the post was removed. Maorisidol is well known for his constant attacks on WA harness racing, WA horses, Gloucester Park etc but you let him continue unabated. I notice there are very few Western Australian members on this forum and the ones that are rarely comment - if by any chance you may wonder why, you may very well have the answer as above. Unfortunately I think people in the West review this forum as very eastern states egocentric which is a shame.

Roddy, because of your thick richly red WA blood coursing thru your veins and the subsequent one eyed passionate parochial view of all things WA that you have, unfortunately when anyone (and mostly me I think, which is fine) simply has a different opinion to you, it's all about WA bashing and not about facts, seemingly in your mind.
TC explained the situation really we'll I thought in that i spoke about Halls actions, which are actual things that happened, which are facts, Rod.
He pulled out and disrupted a bunch of horses.
He caused one driver to be actually unseated, who was lucky enough to remain in the cart.
He caused one horse to gallop cos it was checked in the mayhem and have then no chance in the race. How would you feel if u owned those horses Rod?
Mate, I was talking facts of what happened.
I mentioned a fact that he has a rap sheet that involves him hitting another driver with a whip, a fact, and he was suspended for it.
I mentioned that I had not seen such driving myself in the Eastern states by any of the leading drivers in those states.
If you can show me any instances where a driver outside WA pushes out like Hall does AND SO often as he does so blatantly I look forward to watching those replays.
If you can advise me of another driver in Australia who has also been charged with hitting another driver with a whip, I also look forward to u providing me with that info.

It's not WA bashing Rod, it's raising instances of what happened in a race, and....the driver just happened to be someone who seems to do this often, AND I don't see that behavior so blatantly so often outside WA.

If any driver in Vic or NSW or anywhere did the same thing Rod I would be all over them exactly the same, 100%
Unfortunately for u, it's in your backyard.
And sometimes in life when you or another person does something wrong and are guilty, he or she, and the followers of that person or that footy team or that political party or whatever need to man up, cop it on the chin and say, "you know what I did wrong, he did wrong, they did wrong, I accept that and acknowledge that behavior isn't right."

[Maorisidol]

Sorry teecee, You're the boss but I disagree with your prognosis. I've read many posts with direct attacks on drivers left as is. I had a another comment removed regarding Ricky May's drive in the Auckland Cup earlier this year - all I said was that it was a disgraceful drive and the post was removed. Maorisidol is well known for his constant attacks on WA harness racing, WA horses, Gloucester Park etc but you let him continue unabated. I notice there are very few Western Australian members on this forum and the ones that are rarely comment - if by any chance you may wonder why, you may very well have the answer as above. Unfortunately I think people in the West review this forum as very eastern states egocentric which is a shame.

Now Rod, are u able to give your description of what happened in that race relevant to Hall Jnrs driving at the bell?
Are you able to describe what then happened behind Hall Jnr after what he did at the bell?
And then what's your opinion of all of the above actions by Hall and what's your opinion of what happened to the horses behind Hall due to his actions?
Do you think any penalties should be given out?
Do you think it was safe driving?
Do u think the drivers behind him would think his actions were safe?
How do you think the family of the driver who was nearly tipped out feel?
Do u think Hall did wrong?
Do u think Hall is an angel?
As TC said, u didn't give answers to these questions (apparently, I didn't see your post in response)

[teecee]

You never learn do you. Lot of lily livid wooses over there where females are starting to dominate your driving stats.


Rod....
You may recognise the above quote.
As you apparently didn't grasp what I wrote previously, Can you tell me and other members how this quoted posting of yours in its entirety, contributes to the discussion of the issue regarding the drive of G Hall Jnr. IMO this is a classic case of attacking the personality rather than contributing to discussion of the ISSUE.


Hence it was deleted.
And you ask WHY???

[Mighty Atom]

Rod, I happened to see your post before it was removed. Whilst we expect WA members to be somewhat bias in their comments and fair enough, when you made reference to eastern states Female drivers, you went too far. This is a sport for both sexes and the tone of your comments made me see red on that point. The success of female drivers over in the east can only help the sport in my opinion.

Nothing against female drivers I was merely stating a fact: per ratio of male to female drivers women are dominating over there. Now let me make another statement without all the political correctness advocates jumping up and down - I doubt if they would be anywhere near as successful in W.A. and that's probably the reason we haven't got any over here. It's having more to say about your male drivers than female.

[Mighty Atom]

You never learn do you. Lot of lily livid wooses over there where females are starting to dominate your driving stats.


Rod....
You may recognise the above quote.
As you apparently didn't grasp what I wrote previously, Can you tell me and other members how this quoted posting of yours in its entirety, contributes to the discussion of the issue regarding the drive of G Hall Jnr. IMO this is a classic case of attacking the personality rather than contributing to discussion of the ISSUE.


Hence it was deleted.
And you ask WHY???

No teecee I didn't ask why, I said you removed my post and fair enough. But you still haven't answered the context of my question why you allow maorisidol with the continued anti W.A. sniping such as [Quote] ''Rack up those winners Jnr, set those records in tiny town over there living in your little bubble''. I can visualize a lot of W.A. folk nodding in approval with me.

[Mighty Atom]

Now Rod, are u able to give your description of what happened in that race relevant to Hall Jnrs driving at the bell?
Are you able to describe what then happened behind Hall Jnr after what he did at the bell?
And then what's your opinion of all of the above actions by Hall and what's your opinion of what happened to the horses behind Hall due to his actions?
Do you think any penalties should be given out?
Do you think it was safe driving?
Do u think the drivers behind him would think his actions were safe?
How do you think the family of the driver who was nearly tipped out feel?
Do u think Hall did wrong?
Do u think Hall is an angel?
As TC said, u didn't give answers to these questions (apparently, I didn't see your post in response)

Gary Hall Jnr............master reinsman, winner of more G1's than any other driver, no need to say anymore, the brilliance of the man speaks for itself.

[HaroldParker]

Stewards delayed the All Clear to view the video.

I know when I was in Perth for ID12 there was a big deal made of the candy pole, I think it's in mid stretch ? as a marker for when a driver can attempt to force another driver wider when it's safe to do so. I suspect the Stewards delayed the All Clear to look at where Hall gave Turvey a shove. I think it was Turvey whom Hall took a swing at a few years ago ?

I'm surprised the Stewards didn't have a word with Chris Butt re his drive on Will Of Iron. If not for a stablemate sitting in the running line do you think he takes the trail ? You betcha !

The disappointing aspect in pretty much 100% of these examples is that's it's always a less established driver being asked to be the Donkey. It's the driver that cops it, if it's a young bloke or lass following instructions, go after the trainer. Established drivers want no part of it. It's a risk to their livelihood.

If you're a fan of Karma ... Hall's over aggressive drive on a heavily supported Code Red turned sure victory into defeat. He got locked away in the FFA and the Stewards queried the drive. He lost the last race on protest. If you've not seen the last, take a look. That looked dangerously obvious.

Chris Butt (Will Of Iron) had his charge in the feature in behind Nowtizki before it broke up.

What goes around comes around.

[HaroldParker]

The comment re Lauren Panella being a protected species, are you kidding ?

I can't remember seeing a driver have their drives scrutinized by stewards as much as she does.

Something isn't right there. Perhaps the trainers she mostly drives for...

[Maorisidol]

Gary Hall Jnr............master reinsman, winner of more G1's than any other driver, no need to say anymore, the brilliance of the man speaks for itself.

Rod I asked u about 10 questions about primarily, and let me highlight this so u don't miss it.......THE INCIDENT.....and u cannot seem to answer one of them.

All u do is comeback with your above quote about how good he is from what he has achieved statistically.

It's like u are blind to what he did and can't admit he can do anything wrong.

TC asked u to answer the question (about the incident) also but u seem to not be able to.

[Mighty Atom]

[QUOTE=Maorisidol;28872]Rod I asked u about 10 questions about primarily, and let me highlight this so u don't miss it.......THE INCIDENT.....and u cannot seem to answer one of them.

All u do is comeback with your above quote about how good he is from what he has achieved statistically.

It's like u are blind to what he did and can't admit he can do anything wrong.

TC asked u to answer the question (about the incident) also but u seem to






Who cares ? he's Gary Hall Junior. https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTrsq8i7Dv3afWHx34tKK2WEF0MNLEHC 6Br2gOcPbUEg1whgxwi0Q

[Toohard]

Luv ya work Rod... too good u!

[Toohard]

Rod... looks like I being smart arse.. absolutely not intended!!!
Go You!! My young fella and I heading Menangle Sat week should the old fella get run. Go Trigger!!

[Mighty Atom]

Rod... looks like I being smart arse.. absolutely not intended!!!
Go You!! My young fella and I heading Menangle Sat week should the old fella get run. Go Trigger!!

Thanks Paul, And Trigger should definitely be there next week and he will shake the life out of the Cordina.

[Maorisidol]

interesting info Houdini,

sounds like you are pretty close to the action...

[Maorisidol]

Pretty sure this post will do a disapearing act.

interseting tho Brenno...
if 1 person has this knowledge (assuming its true of course) many people would know you might think? drivers, trainers, strappers, owners?

[teecee]

Sorry people Brenno's right. Unfortunately Post and Poster gone making this part of the thread more than a little disjointed.
Feel free to delete your contributions if you wish

[Big K]

Hi Ash
Here's the stewards report!!

Stewards delayed giving the ‘All Clear” to ascertain the circumstances surrounding an incident racing out of the front straight to receive the bell where Gary Hall Jnr (SOHO HIGHROLLER) moved from the line of the marker posts to a one wide position. Several runners were checked behind. It was established that as Gary Hall Jnr had commenced his outward shift it had initially been resisted by Nathan Turvey (TAKEABOW) before that gelding was taken to the three wide line. As TAKEABOW lost momentum when being eased TRENTS COURAGE NZ (Craig Saligari) which was following made contact with its sulky and broke gait, severely checking GALACTIC GALLEON NZ (Ryan Warwick) and causing several runners to be checked. At the same time Chris Voak (ZURBARAN) who had commenced a forward move in the three wide line raced four wide for a short distance. It was clarified that he had not raced to the outside of TAKEABOW before that gelding was obliged to race wider and Chris Voak had elected to move to the four wide line to maintain his momentum. Under all the circumstances no action was taken.

He drove completely wtihin the the rules as such,to say you know more than the rules is incorrect.A racing incident occurred after he legally pushed out at the bell.The horse he was driving was travelling quite fiercely and in fact could have led to a more serious consequence had he not moved when he did.
Have a nice day.

[Mighty Atom]

Hi Ash
Here's the stewards report!!

Stewards delayed giving the ‘All Clear” to ascertain the circumstances surrounding an incident racing out of the front straight to receive the bell where Gary Hall Jnr (SOHO HIGHROLLER) moved from the line of the marker posts to a one wide position. Several runners were checked behind. It was established that as Gary Hall Jnr had commenced his outward shift it had initially been resisted by Nathan Turvey (TAKEABOW) before that gelding was taken to the three wide line. As TAKEABOW lost momentum when being eased TRENTS COURAGE NZ (Craig Saligari) which was following made contact with its sulky and broke gait, severely checking GALACTIC GALLEON NZ (Ryan Warwick) and causing several runners to be checked. At the same time Chris Voak (ZURBARAN) who had commenced a forward move in the three wide line raced four wide for a short distance. It was clarified that he had not raced to the outside of TAKEABOW before that gelding was obliged to race wider and Chris Voak had elected to move to the four wide line to maintain his momentum. Under all the circumstances no action was taken.

He drove completely wtihin the the rules as such,to say you know more than the rules is incorrect.A racing incident occurred after he legally pushed out at the bell.The horse he was driving was travelling quite fiercely and in fact could have led to a more serious consequence had he not moved when he did.
Have a nice day.

Thanks for clarifying that Big K, I should have seen the stewards report before making statements that G.Hall Jnr was guilty. So I apologize to G.Hall Jnr and I'm removing all the guilty wording from my above posting.
Oh dear Ash, any words of remorse from you and a belated apology?

[Triple V]

I'd put Jrn up in a heart beat. Terrific, competitive, ethusiastic Driver.

[Richard prior]

Hell Yeh, Totally agree VVV. Come on Ash, It's time to Man Up and bury the hatchet.

[Maorisidol]

Thanks for clarifying that Big K, I should have seen the stewards report before making statements that G.Hall Jnr was guilty. So I apologize to G.Hall Jnr and I'm removing all the guilty wording from my above posting.
Oh dear Ash, any words of remorse from you and a belated apology?

Really interesting thing u said there Rod, "I should have seen the stewards report before making statements that GHall was guilty."
So before u knew the stewards report, based on your evidence like me of watching the race, Rod from Fremantle thought Hall was guilty.
U even said he was guilty to all 10 or so questions I asked u about "the incident". Guilty to being unsafe Rod, your words mate...
This is even what the race caller said at the time of the incident, "oooh, that got a bit rough there, he came away from the inside Hall Jnr and turned sideways there was Takeabow, a couple of others slightly inconvenienced, and one galloped and that was Trent's Courage..."
So everyone is traveling along nicely and safely and then who caused things to get " a bit rough"??????????????????????????
Hall Jnr.
But he did nothing wrong. Are u serious? Please...
Then stewards give their report and now he's not guilty as the rules go. I accept that.
I just don't agree with such a ridiculous situation as to where that when he pulled out he pushed out the horse next to him and, THIS CAUSED A WHOLE BUNCH OF INTERFERENCE WHERE ONE DRIVER NEARLY GOT TIPPED OUT AND ANOTHER HORSE GALLOPED OUT OF THE RACE.
crazy in my opinion that rule. What a technicality that in that situation leaves no blame to men or horses potentially being harmed. And seemingly in the stewards description that Hall moved theoretically correctly, if someone did get tipped out it would have been no ones fault
Question, why don't we see this type of driving in the Eastern states?
Does Bathurst not have this rule? It's a little track?
Seriously can someone in Australia explain why we don't see this type of incident AS PREVALENT (not one situation every blue moon, and I cannot remember seeing one in the last, I don't know when!) in the Eastern states?

[Maorisidol]

Hi Ash

.The horse he was driving was travelling quite fiercely and in fact could have led to a more serious consequence had he not moved when he did.
Have a nice day.

Bollocks.
Personally I didn't see his horse traveling fiercely.
I agree it travelled a little ungenerously...
However if a horse is pulling fiercely, a driver would be almost hanging out the back of the cart trying to restrain it from pulling too hard, and if u watch the replay, Jnr is totally upright, his arms are not seemingly outstretched struggling in anyway.
If u watch the horse for at least half a lap before, he certainly was not settled and was definitely wanting to get on with the job, but and here's my major belief, Jnr to me seemed totally ABLE to control the horse. If it was out of control and a potential "more serious" situation was going to happen Hall would have HAD to push out earlier.
Is that not common sense if it was SOOOO fierce and out of control? he totally may have been working hard, but he was in control.
If anyone reckons he was not controlling that horse, that's an insult to him!
He was merely waiting for the bell lap, and then out he goes cos the rules say it's ok.

[Danno]

This is one of those times where our game is made to look crook no matter what way we go. The rule in WA obviously allow for pushing out and the Stewards there obviously rule accordingly, I haven't seen anyone complaining about horses getting caught on the inside at GP so I assume so.

Someone was bagging Mark Purdon the other day because he didn't get out 'til the show was over but that was in in NZ not WA was it??

'Bout time our industry heads got together on this one because punters are getting confused and hence irritated due to the lack of consistency and subsequent understanding of the rules.

Many years ago ( 1970?)Phil Coulson won the interdominion final in New Zealand on "Juniours Image" , he had a time of it getting that horse into the clear around 800m from home, but at the time in NZ they had a rule allowing drivers to push out and I have to say in my opinion it was a great drive! certainly not a drive where Phil Coulson should have been getting bagged.

When I had my first few drives in 1975 in NSW there was no push out allowed and I copped a few holidays for getting horses out into winning positions ( I always thought that was what punters wanted) through pushing out.

A few years ago in NSW we were allowed to push out anytime in the last lap and the length of the home straight........a rule I thought was pretty good for both drivers and punters, now we have a rule where you are allowed to push out at the "Candy Pole", which would be OK if the people driving had any idea about how to push out safely and the stipes had any idea what that actually means!! I have seen so many unsafe botched attempts at pushing out in the last few years it makes you wonder!!

One of our so called "professional" drivers here in the Hunter Valley tipped one of his mates out a while back and had absolutely NFID how he had done it...I was 3 wide outside them on the home turn watching it unfold,.... incredulous that the "professional" had absolutely no idea what he was about to do to his mate!!!

The rules need to be conformed both interstae in Aus and with our mates across the ditch, and if the rules are then allowing a push out factor we should then have some training for ALL drivers on how to do it safely.

BTW, I thought Jnrs drive was a pearler, the galloping and other interference was a by product of that drive, but that was because the racing room was very restricted right at the moment he pushed out, maybe because the other drivers could see what he was up to and were trying to close up in response.

cheers,

Dan

[Maorisidol]

If you're a fan of Karma ... He lost the last race on protest. If you've not seen the last, take a look. That looked dangerously obvious.

What goes around comes around.
Obvious alright.
If u watch his hands in driving the horse into the straight at least 2, maybe 3 times he pulls on the right reign and u can see the horses mouth/head turn right ever so slightly each time and of course steers itself thru the drivers direction towards the middle of the track.
Why would Hall do this?
Why would he steer his horse out in front of another that was coming up to challenge and look a great threat to him losing the race?
What? To get in its way? NO. He is a nice man with lots of Group 1 wins, lots of wins every week, he is G Hall Jnr "master reinsman, the brilliance of the man speaks for itself", quoted from Rod from Fremantle, thnx Rod.
Yep.
And his actions say a lot about what makes him tick, his personal and professional ethics, and the type of man he is.
Unfortunately for his obvious high level of skills and no doubt he is a high skilled driver, I have never said he is not, I find some of his actions aren't for me and are also not for the stewards... (Very carefully choosing my words here, I can feel Teecee looking over my shoulder!!! And Rod!!!

[Big K]

Hello Ash
I took liberty to cut and paste parts of your comments.Facts and opinions shouldnt be intertwined

I really don't like this person. (this is a fact)
f**k you! I don't care if I push you over or hurt you or your horse! I need to win this race" (this is your opinion)
set those records in tiny town over there living in your little bubble knowing that a man is also judged on character, Honour, self respect and integrity (this is your opinion on WA and Hall)
Roddy, because of your thick richly red WA blood coursing thru your veins and the subsequent one eyed passionate parochial view of all things WA that you have, unfortunately when anyone (and mostly me I think, which is fine) simply has a different opinion to you, it's all about WA bashing and not about facts, seemingly in your mind. (the facts are written in the stewards report,you have only written your opinion on being a West Aussie))
He caused one driver to be actually unseated, who was lucky enough to remain in the cart. (not true,this is your opinion)
He caused one horse to gallop cos it was checked in the mayhem and have then no chance in the race. How would you feel if u owned those horses Rod? (not true,this is your opinion)
Mate, I was talking facts of what happened. (no,you talked only of your opinion)
And sometimes in life when you or another person does something wrong and are guilty, he or she, and the followers of that person or that footy team or that political party or whatever need to man up, cop it on the chin and say, "you know what I did wrong, he did wrong, they did wrong, I accept that and acknowledge that behavior isn't right." (Please refer to the stewards report)
Bollocks.
Personally I didn't see his horse traveling fiercely (In my opininion it was)
What? To get in its way? NO. He is a nice man with lots of Group 1 wins, lots of wins every week, he is G Hall Jnr "master reinsman, the brilliance of the man speaks for itself", quoted from Rod from Fremantle, thnx Rod. (???????)

I think the first comment completely covers all of your opinions expressed in the above. You may not like him Ash but a lot of people do,I dont think he is that bad of a person but I guess that its only my opinion.

Have a nice day

[Maorisidol]

Hello Ash
I took liberty to cut and paste parts of your comments.Facts and opinions shouldnt be intertwined

I really don't like this person. (this is a fact)
f**k you! I don't care if I push you over or hurt you or your horse! I need to win this race" (this is your opinion)
set those records in tiny town over there living in your little bubble knowing that a man is also judged on character, Honour, self respect and integrity (this is your opinion on WA and Hall)
Roddy, because of your thick richly red WA blood coursing thru your veins and the subsequent one eyed passionate parochial view of all things WA that you have, unfortunately when anyone (and mostly me I think, which is fine) simply has a different opinion to you, it's all about WA bashing and not about facts, seemingly in your mind. (the facts are written in the stewards report,you have only written your opinion on being a West Aussie))
He caused one driver to be actually unseated, who was lucky enough to remain in the cart. (not true,this is your opinion)
He caused one horse to gallop cos it was checked in the mayhem and have then no chance in the race. How would you feel if u owned those horses Rod? (not true,this is your opinion)
Mate, I was talking facts of what happened. (no,you talked only of your opinion)
And sometimes in life when you or another person does something wrong and are guilty, he or she, and the followers of that person or that footy team or that political party or whatever need to man up, cop it on the chin and say, "you know what I did wrong, he did wrong, they did wrong, I accept that and acknowledge that behavior isn't right." (Please refer to the stewards report)
Bollocks.
Personally I didn't see his horse traveling fiercely (In my opininion it was)
What? To get in its way? NO. He is a nice man with lots of Group 1 wins, lots of wins every week, he is G Hall Jnr "master reinsman, the brilliance of the man speaks for itself", quoted from Rod from Fremantle, thnx Rod. (???????)

I think the first comment completely covers all of your opinions expressed in the above. You may not like him Ash but a lot of people do,I dont think he is that bad of a person but I guess that its only my opinion.

Have a nice day

Thanks Big Kev,
More to the point i dont like his actions really. I am sure from what i have seen of him hes probably a nice bloke, but even nice blokes sometimes do things that arent great, we are all human after all.
My main gripe is when you do have a highly skilled individual who is very successful and therefore does "represent" the sport in a way more than others because of his/her profile, i get disappointed when they do things like Gary has done in the past and been suspended for (fact, not my opinion). now most drivers get a holiday every now and then but his history is peppered with some unfortunate suspensions that questions his character (the whip incident). fact.
I guess i could sum it up and say, in my opinion Kev, he wouldnt be winning a Best and FAIREST driver award.
anyway enough of this topic from me i am sure lots of people are getting bored, over and out.

[Triple V]

The various views of the rights or wrongs of Jnr's actions aside (I haven't seen the race in question), something that I think a lot of people need to keep in mind here is that Racing is like many other sports, Soccer for example, you play to the Ref's whistle or the Linesman's flag.
To do anything less is to lose, plain & simple.
The task set of the Stewards is to police the sport whilst the task set of the Driver is to win the race or if not then ensure his/her horse finishes in the best posssible position.
It is not and it never has been up to the Drivers to self regulate. They work within the confines dictated by the actions/views/edicts of the Stewards.
In fact they should and are for mine totally expected to do everything possible within the framework of their local Stewards interpretation of the Rules in order to win races for their Owners.
In this case, if the WA Stewards are Ok with Jnr pushing out in such a fashion then given his mission in each & every race is to win then why on Earth would he not do so until such time as he is told otherwise?

[Maorisidol]

The various views of the rights or wrongs of Jnr's actions aside (I haven't seen the race in question), something that I think a lot of people need to keep in mind here is that Racing is like many other sports, Soccer for example, you play to the Ref's whistle or the Linesman's flag.
To do anything less is to lose, plain & simple.
The task set of the Stewards is to police the sport whilst the task set of the Driver is to win the race or if not then ensure his/her horse finishes in the best posssible position.
It is not and it never has been up to the Drivers to self regulate. They work within the confines dictated by the actions/views/edicts of the Stewards.
In fact they should and are for mine totally expected to do everything possible within the framework of their local Stewards interpretation of the Rules in order to win races for their Owners.
In this case, if the WA Stewards are Ok with Jnr pushing out in such a fashion then given his mission in each & every race is to win then why on Earth would he not do so until such time as he is told otherwise?

Race 1 last Fri at GP Jaimie...go have a look, and pretend u know nothing of this thread, watch the race so u actually see the incident from the perspective of someone who has watched trotting races as long as u have, and I would be interested in knowing your initial gut feelings...

[Mighty Atom]

Really interesting thing u said there Rod, "I should have seen the stewards report before making statements that GHall was guilty."
So before u knew the stewards report, based on your evidence like me of watching the race, Rod from Fremantle thought Hall was guilty.
U even said he was guilty to all 10 or so questions I asked u about "the incident". Guilty to being unsafe Rod, your words mate...
This is even what the race caller said at the time of the incident, "oooh, that got a bit rough there, he came away from the inside Hall Jnr and turned sideways there was Takeabow, a couple of others slightly inconvenienced, and one galloped and that was Trent's Courage..."
So everyone is traveling along nicely and safely and then who caused things to get " a bit rough"??????????????????????????
Hall Jnr.
But he did nothing wrong. Are u serious? Please...
Then stewards give their report and now he's not guilty as the rules go. I accept that.
I just don't agree with such a ridiculous situation as to where that when he pulled out he pushed out the horse next to him and, THIS CAUSED A WHOLE BUNCH OF INTERFERENCE WHERE ONE DRIVER NEARLY GOT TIPPED OUT AND ANOTHER HORSE GALLOPED OUT OF THE RACE.
crazy in my opinion that rule. What a technicality that in that situation leaves no blame to men or horses potentially being harmed. And seemingly in the stewards description that Hall moved theoretically correctly, if someone did get tipped out it would have been no ones fault
Question, why don't we see this type of driving in the Eastern states?
Does Bathurst not have this rule? It's a little track?
Seriously can someone in Australia explain why we don't see this type of incident AS PREVALENT (not one situation every blue moon, and I cannot remember seeing one in the last, I don't know when!) in the Eastern states?

Yep, I said Hall was guilty but my opinion doesn't count, the stewards in W.A. do allow to push out and G.Hall Jnr is a master of it and the stewards are the adjudicators. Should have kept my mouth shut until I saw the report. So if my opinion doesn't hold up on the guilty charge neither does yours. As I've said before it's a gladiator arena at G.P where only the strongest survive.

[Maorisidol]

Yep, I said Hall was guilty but my opinion doesn't count, the stewards in W.A. do allow to push out and G.Hall Jnr is a master of it and the stewards are the adjudicators. Should have kept my mouth shut until I saw the report. So if my opinion doesn't hold up on the guilty charge neither does yours. As I've said before it's a gladiator arena at G.P where only the strongest survive.

Yep, only gladiators should apply to drive in WA, and from what u have written earlier in your post that was deleted, in your opinion, no women should apply seemingly.
Cos the eastern states are full of wooses where woman dominate as u said Ron. Bloody women , can't have that goin on in Perth mate!
Hang on, is it 2013 or 1953, crickey I'm confused!!!

[Lucky Camilla"s Lovechild]

The various views of the rights or wrongs of Jnr's actions aside (I haven't seen the race in question), something that I think a lot of people need to keep in mind here is that Racing is like many other sports, Soccer for example, you play to the Ref's whistle or the Linesman's flag.
To do anything less is to lose, plain & simple.
The task set of the Stewards is to police the sport whilst the task set of the Driver is to win the race or if not then ensure his/her horse finishes in the best posssible position.
It is not and it never has been up to the Drivers to self regulate. They work within the confines dictated by the actions/views/edicts of the Stewards.
In fact they should and are for mine totally expected to do everything possible within the framework of their local Stewards interpretation of the Rules in order to win races for their Owners.
In this case, if the WA Stewards are Ok with Jnr pushing out in such a fashion then given his mission in each & every race is to win then why on Earth would he not do so until such time as he is told otherwise?
Spot on VVV. As I posted earlier, it says more about the stewards in charge than the incident. Hes gonna keep doing it till he gets his wings clipped. Funnily enough, I saw one of his drives a couple of weeks earlier. Similar scenario. But he didnt even try to get off the fence. Just run up dots. For anyone thinking this is just East v. West thing. That is just bulls**t! It is just plain dangerous driving. And a crazy rule to boot. Does it need a serious injury or death to happen before it is reviewed/changed?

[Maorisidol]

Spot on VVV. As I posted earlier, it says more about the stewards in charge than the incident. Hes gonna keep doing it till he gets his wings clipped. Funnily enough, I saw one of his drives a couple of weeks earlier. Similar scenario. But he didnt even try to get off the fence. Just run up dots. For anyone thinking this is just East v. West thing. That is just bulls**t! It is just plain dangerous driving. And a crazy rule to boot. Does it need a serious injury or death to happen before it is reviewed/changed?
Thanku Leigh,
Finally someone else who sees what I see and for the betterment of the sport. That's what I am about and thanks again u also have a brain and see/feel/understand that's it's not east/west.
Unfortunately some parochial chaps and the block winkers they wear can't seem to see the big picture for safety of all concerned.

[Chariots]

Apparently received A 28 day suspension for the race he lost on protest effective immediately.

[matrightyeh]

not cool feel for them https://imageshackau.com/sports/131/b/happy.gifhttps://imageshackau.com/sports/133/b/happy.gifhttps://imageshackau.com/sports/138/b/happy.gif
https://imageshackau.com/sports/123/b/happy.gifhttps://imageshackau.com/sports/52/b/happy.gifhttps://imageshackau.com/sports/145/b/happy.gifhttps://imageshackau.com/sports/134/b/happy.gif

[Lenem]

when & where?

[Chariots]

GP race 10 15th November.