Programming

[dmac43]

Not many 4yo+ Co's programmed in the last 5 weeks of the season. Expect to see lots of short price 3yo's winning C0's in this period. Doesn't help the winless 4yo's hoping to get their breeders bonus

24/7 - Charlton - Real Character $1.50 Win
23/7 - Melton - Melita Bromac $1.20 Win 2nd also a 3yo
22/7 - Terang - Hurricane Stride $1.60 Win

[Amlin]

One could ask the question at the moment - where are the horses? The last week or so have seen field sizes quite small across Victoria - a six race card last Sunday twilight and another this weekend for good measure.


Recent figures (races-acceptors). I have excluded the Maryborough carnival due to higher stakes, feature races, particular events (non-standard country meets in other words!)


Mildura 25/7 8-67
Kilmore 24/7 8-76
Charlton 24/7 8-81
Melton 23/7 7-64
Echuca 23/7 8-65
Terang 22/7 8-67
Warragul 21/7 7-67
Mildura 20/7 6-54
Bendigo 18/7 8-75
Cobram 17/7 8-81
Ballarat 17/7 8-72


People might be able to come up with some excuses (Redwood etc) but rather than looking at why things have dropped off short term, I am interested to hear what strategies must be/should already be in place for the longer term?

[aussiebreno]

One could ask the question at the moment - where are the horses? The last week or so have seen field sizes quite small across Victoria - a six race card last Sunday twilight and another this weekend for good measure.


Recent figures (races-acceptors). I have excluded the Maryborough carnival due to higher stakes, feature races, particular events (non-standard country meets in other words!)


Mildura 25/7 8-67
Kilmore 24/7 8-76
Charlton 24/7 8-81
Melton 23/7 7-64
Echuca 23/7 8-65
Terang 22/7 8-67
Warragul 21/7 7-67
Mildura 20/7 6-54
Bendigo 18/7 8-75
Cobram 17/7 8-81
Ballarat 17/7 8-72


People might be able to come up with some excuses (Redwood etc) but rather than looking at why things have dropped off short term, I am interested to hear what strategies must be/should already be in place for the longer term?
Off on a tangent a bit but the Riverina has always struggled for numbers in the winter months. We are well into July this season and fields are still going strong. I reckon the programming keeping weaker horses in work trying to gain that elusive win whereas in the past trainers couldn't be bothered working shit in the cold. Thats just my observations, I would be interested to know if the stats back this up.

[Messenger]

One could ask the question at the moment - where are the horses? The last week or so have seen field sizes quite small across Victoria - a six race card last Sunday twilight and another this weekend for good measure.


Recent figures (races-acceptors). I have excluded the Maryborough carnival due to higher stakes, feature races, particular events (non-standard country meets in other words!)


Mildura 25/7 8-67
Kilmore 24/7 8-76
Charlton 24/7 8-81
Melton 23/7 7-64
Echuca 23/7 8-65
Terang 22/7 8-67
Warragul 21/7 7-67
Mildura 20/7 6-54
Bendigo 18/7 8-75
Cobram 17/7 8-81
Ballarat 17/7 8-72


People might be able to come up with some excuses (Redwood etc) but rather than looking at why things have dropped off short term, I am interested to hear what strategies must be/should already be in place for the longer term?

Kyle you and others may be interested in another report by Ray Chaplin on Standardbred Breeding and Utilization. I am sure he would be happy to email it to you if you contact him at
contact@equineexcellence.biz

Here is a small portion of the report:

A common decline in breeding


Country North America New Zealand Australia

Population 350,000,000 4,500,000 23,000,000

Live foals 2011 9,859 2,401 4,809

Live foals 1980 20,903 4,362 12,109

Decline (80 - 11) - 53% - 45% - 60%


Population size has been included to put into context the relative penetration of harness racing and the resultant Standardbred breeding industry in each of the jurisdictions


Comparing the number of live foals bred with size of population indicates that New Zealand is clearly the leading nation for the penetration of harness racing per capita followed by Australia


The USA/Canada population is approximately fifteen times larger than that of Australia


4,809 live foals born in Australia in 2011 would equate to approximately 72,000 live foals born in the North America in the same year (9,859 foals were born)


The Australian population is approximately five times larger than that of New Zealand


2,401 live foals born in New Zealand in 2011 would equate to approximately 12,000 live foals born in Australia in the same year (4,809 live foals were born)


The sixty per cent decline in the number of live foals bred in Australia in the period 1980 - 2011 is significantly greater than the other countries


This result can only be attributed to industry management, and currently the administrative regime of Australia’s largest state still maintain there is no issue in terms of the decline in foal numbers and the resultant effect on the racing population


As a key performance indicator reflecting the health of the sport in each jurisdiction these results indicate the perilous decline of one key pillar that supports wagering turnover and business revenue – that being the future availability of sufficient product

Apologies for the Table not copying very well

[kung fu man]

Interesting trial tomorrow 3 trotters one has had 1 start put in a trial with Mach Wiper and wait for it...........For a Reason!!!!

[Race For Fun]

Would have to be a mistake you would think as there are two other trotters in another trial. Would have thought they would make a trotters trial and all Metro class pacers in together. Hope these trials weren't drawn up by the handicapper who is in charge of race fields. It's an uphill battle for the trotter in NSW.

[aussiebreno]

Would have to be a mistake you would think as there are two other trotters in another trial. Would have thought they would make a trotters trial and all Metro class pacers in together. Hope these trials weren't drawn up by the handicapper who is in charge of race fields. It's an uphill battle for the trotter in NSW.
It's a stand start trial hence the trial make up.

[Race For Fun]

It's a stand start trial hence the trial make up.

Yep and many a time in the country there would have been no trial for the paces as would have been told not enough horses as you can't have cup class paces in with TO class trotters. Been there done that.

[kung fu man]

It's a stand start trial hence the trial make up.Doesnt matter what the start is you dont trial a horse thats had 1 dtart or even average performers with 1.50 horses its just not done!

[aussiebreno]

Doesnt matter what the start is you dont trial a horse thats had 1 dtart or even average performers with 1.50 horses its just not done!
Yes I get that part, my post was only for RaceForFun who suggested throwing the trotters in the other trial and the pacers in the other pacing trial - those other trials being mobile start whilst this is stand start.

[Race For Fun]

Yes I get that part, my post was only for RaceForFun who suggested throwing the trotters in the other trial and the pacers in the other pacing trial - those other trials being mobile start whilst this is stand start.

Might be my fault Brendan I was aware that it was a stand but I left that part out, I should have written that the pacers would have been drawn up in a mobile trial with faster class horses. Sorry if there was a misunderstanding.

[Messenger]

Coming home today to go to Hamilton tomorrow but just looked up fields and find there are only 6 races! Might still have gone but find the last is so late that I will be dodging kangaroos.
Then notice that there is a meeting at Melton and think I could go to that on way home but it is a Sunday Night meeting!
Clearly attendances are not eve considered nowadays

[Messenger]

Do we really need to make the attraction race the last race at this time of the year?
The good program at Charlton tomorrow really tempted me but I am not staying until 5pm to dodge Kangas while possibly looking into the setting sun

http://www.harness.org.au/fields.cfm?mc=CH100615&fromstate=vic#8
http://www.harness.org.au/news-article.cfm?news_id=26701

[codywinnell]

Do we really need to make the attraction race the last race at this time of the year?
The good program at Charlton tomorrow really tempted me but I am not staying until 5pm to dodge Kangas while possibly looking into the setting sun

http://www.harness.org.au/fields.cfm?mc=CH100615&fromstate=vic#8
http://www.harness.org.au/news-article.cfm?news_id=26701



Hi Kevin,

That time slot, I'm told, is clearly the strongest from an off-course wagering point of view.

[aussiebreno]

The trot has just been run at Horsham and it seemed to gather a few more spectators than the previous races but on counting there was less than 50 of us on the steps. There was about 40 blokes but I would only bet that 2 of them are younger than me - I am a few weeks short of 60.
I know it is a Wednesday arvo and probably anyone not retired should be at work but it made me think - if it is true that punters will only bet on what they can watch, are daytime punters mostly over 60, Pro's or in the loo at work with their i phone

[Messenger]

The trot has just been run at Horsham and it seemed to gather a few more spectators than the previous races but on counting there was less than 50 of us on the steps. There was about 40 blokes but I would only bet that 2 of them are younger than me - I am a few weeks short of 60.
I know it is a Wednesday arvo and probably anyone not retired should be at work but it made me think - if it is true that punters will only bet on what they can watch, are daytime punters mostly over 60, Pro's or in the loo at work with their i phone

Whoever wrote that is clearly very intelligent Brenno ;)

I am sooking because I wanted to go but would not stay around for the last race BUT when the last race is the cream of the meeting you cannot justify the trip

I really do understand that attendances mean zip nowadays but I think that we have to at least take night attendances seriously for as I have said many times before - I doubt tomorrows owners (the lifeblood of our sport) are going to come from club or home lounges

[Amlin]

I can recall when all clubs participated in the Sires series - the heat on the program usually assisted the little clubs in also getting good entries for the support card and you could promote the card locally to generate some interest. A memory now though for clubs like mine as we send our trainers all over the state in order to compete in the series.

[codywinnell]

It'd be great to see thousands flocking to the trots every meeting, everywhere, but alas times have changed from what I often hear referred to as "the good old days". The industry lifeblood is the wagering dollar. You maximise that and reap as much benefit as you can from it, and then you have a war chest to increase awareness through marketing and media, bolster stakes and hopefully build crowds. It's an ultra-competitive wagering market. You can bet on so much more now than just racing and Aussie Rules win/loss, under 39.5 and over 39.5 points etc nowadays.

Getting the programming right is pivotal and while many will have their views about how it should be done, I can assure you HRV has some very experienced programmers who take lots of factors into account when deciding which races should go where on a race card.

[Messenger]

It'd be great to see thousands flocking to the trots every meeting, everywhere, but alas times have changed from what I often hear referred to as "the good old days". The industry lifeblood is the wagering dollar. You maximise that and reap as much benefit as you can from it, and then you have a war chest to increase awareness through marketing and media, bolster stakes and hopefully build crowds. It's an ultra-competitive wagering market. You can bet on so much more now than just racing and Aussie Rules win/loss, under 39.5 and over 39.5 points etc nowadays.

Getting the programming right is pivotal and while many will have their views about how it should be done, I can assure you HRV has some very experienced programmers who take lots of factors into account when deciding which races should go where on a race card.

I was having a whinge because it did not suit me as a traveller but seriously Cody, blind Freddy would know that the latest race on a day program is going to have a better chance of more punters especially with a couple of better known horses in it but I am sure the programmers are very experienced colleagues. I wonder whether they picked that the R3 C0 would hold just as much on the TAB?
The industry lifeblood is also the horses and thus owners until betting on cartoons becomes more popular
IMO you are unlikely to become an owner if you have never attended a few meetings
I reckon the 'hopefully build crowds' might take a bit of planning - other than that we need to hope that the old herd have been very fertile and put their stamp on their progeny

[codywinnell]

I was having a whinge because it did not suit me as a traveller but seriously Cody, blind Freddy would know that the latest race on a day program is going to have a better chance of more punters especially with a couple of better known horses in it but I am sure the programmers are very experienced colleagues. I wonder whether they picked that the R3 C0 would hold just as much on the TAB?
The industry lifeblood is also the horses and thus owners until betting on cartoons becomes more popular
IMO you are unlikely to become an owner if you have never attended a few meetings
I reckon the 'hopefully build crowds' might take a bit of planning - other than that we need to hope that the old herd have been very fertile and put their stamp on their progeny



As I said, it would be great to see thousands pour through the gates on a mid-week program at a Charlton or Hamilton etc - as an old-school trots fan myself, who is much younger than the hardened trots fans you seem to speak of - I love being track side at a meeting with a big crowd.

But programmers would be remiss not to factor the wagering dollar in when putting a race card together.

IMHO, get the wagering dollar right to secure the best return for harness racing and it opens up the opportunity to invest heavier in marketing, communications, breeding, ownership promotions, horse welfare, you name it. Secure a greater share of the wagering dollar and the sky's the limit.

As a trots fan yourself Kevin, what sort of approach would you take to programming a mid-week meeting?

[Messenger]

Day meetings are no doubt a tricky one for attracting attendances. Night meetings should be much easier and I would like to see Harness racing make at least one night its own before the gallops under lights take all the nights too.
When I say night meetings should be easier I am not discounting the negative influence of winter weather but I am assuming we provide warm dining experiences for those who want them.
Factors I would take into consideration for mid-week meetings with a view to increasing attendances would be

Having regular days for particular tracks eg Stawell is the first Monday of the month, Ballarat is the 2nd and 4th Thursday etc etc

Decide on whether Friday or Saturday night is going to be our main Metro night. If it is Saturday then I would look at whether you could make the Friday afternoon meeting a big businessmen late lunch day - where is the problem? This idea probably does not have legs as we have no suitable venue (Don't get me started on the Melton decision)

Putting a good meeting on Wednesdays as that is the main midweek gallops day and has spin off potential - maybe alternate between a couple of good clubs, choosing the one furthest from the gallops in the hope of attracting a few punters onto our course to bet on both codes. I think Melton could be one of the venues and maybe Cranbourne could be the other (although I have no idea of what there facilities are like nowadays) as they offer alternative sides of Melbourne in populated areas

If there is more than one Trot race on the program, the 2nd (and 3rd?) one should be at the start of the program as it gives attendees a chance to tailor their arrival as I think we really do have 3 types of harness fans - T, P or T&P and I think turnover is a little less on Trots races so let's keep the end of the program free for pacing races

I think the practice of putting Restricted $3k meetings on the days where we have 2 meetings is a good one but sometimes wonder whether adding a little cream by way of one interesting race eg C4+ could have benefits

Although we are only talking a few weeks of the year, I would be selecting venues carefully during school holiday times and marketing them strongly - we may just find our future fans at these meets

I will come back to you on other ideas but the sun is shining right now and I must get hiking.
EVERYBODY please give Cody your ideas too

[codywinnell]

Cheers Kevin, love your feedback, enthusiasm and ideas. It's all food for thought!

As I'm the comms man these aren't my areas, but always happy to provide response from areas within HRV for those who have questions on any matter via this forum - be it programming, racing, form and wagering etc etc.... And also happy to pass on different ideas garnered from the web/social media/email/talking to people at the track for discussion and consideration @ HRV too.

[codywinnell]

PS - enjoy the sun, Kevin! Cracking day out there.

[Amlin]

I know the harness racing calendar is programmed after the gallops one to co-ordinate multi use venues (Kilmore/Cranbourne) etc and it would be very difficult in this era given the sheer volume of racing each week, but one query I have is to whether there is any check done re other codes racing in the immediate area on the same day.


As an example, recently we had Moe races, Cranbourne trots, Warragul dogs, Sale dogs and Sandown dogs all on a Sunday. Only one other Victorian meeting was held outside the South East/Gippsland region, that being Ballarat races.


Appreciate it is difficult to get the balance right and that on-course attendances would be a struggle in Winter but this example is hardly ideal especially on a weekend.