Printable View
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Yep, he's just getting warmed up over that short distance but it's all academic, race is run and won. We'll never know.
If you wanted a match race between the two in their prime, I'd chuck Poppy in to make it really interesting.
Is that the race where Karloo Mick finish second Brent? If so, I remember that clearly. Quinny went berzerk with Trigger, then Trigger immediately pulled of his back when crossed, from there Quinny had a dream run but managed 3rd. The excitement of those years watching 2 great horses go at it was amazing! Robert, I could throw in Gammalite, Village kid as well, and some of my fav's from the 90's- Iraklis, Franco Tiger, Franco Ice, etc etc. I had a very soft spot for Sinbad Bay. What a horse! So many greats.
It's great that all of us are so excited about these horses today & passionate, regardless of opinions or favourite horses.
Maybe the other drivers were reading the Courier Mail...
The chastening news for tonight’s rivals is that Hall believes his horse will be improved by the run but he may have no option from the wide draw to go back tonight and bank on its electric final sprint.
Did Hall Snr play mind games with them.. :p
I would like to say that as much as I give Bart a -1/10 for last nights drive, he is definitely a serious young driver. Never a 2nd thought enters my mind when backing one of his charges.
Always good to keep the opposition in 2 minds if you have a good horse.
I have been out walking but have to reply to this one Ev as you do not seem to realize how your posts read. You have not bagged Quinny so much as inferred he is not a great horse. 2 eg's from earlier posts of yoursQuote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
"I suppose it comes down to personal preference in what constitutes a great horse or a great race"
"I don't look at a horses stake money to decide wether that defines them as one of the greatest horse"
but I could be wrong, all you have to do is reply that Quinny is a great horse ;)
I have no problem in saying Quinny is a great horse at all. I personally prefer horses like the style of Trigger who are warriors more than flashy brilliant type, but that doesn't mean they aren't both greats in there own way. Yesterday was not a great race IMO, regardless that they smashed the record. Yes, it is what it is, but it is what it is because of that very poor drive from Cockburn. He was making it clear as day that he would not give up the breeze to Quinn, yet he easily let him slide to the breeze, only then to overtake him. Hasn't Cockburn seen what Quinny can do from such a close position, let alone the 1/1..? Horrible drive! And SSL must have thought it was a trial.
We will be seeing Quinny in the FFA this coming weekend.. GHS wants to keep him sharp for the BAF in a fortnight. Let's hope that they don't just hand it to him on a silver platter this time :)
Look you guys are right that the drive did not make any sense in that if he wanted the death why did he not keep ITMQ out at the start because as you say he offered no resistance then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Only Cockburn can tell us what he was thinking. Maybe he thinks as quickly as me (hold on while I pin this big ticket on myself) for I was just thinking that GHJ is taking hold to look for cover and almost instantaneously Avonnova was off. Not that that means he should have provided it unless he was sure SSL was coming but he may have preferred to try doing a SU from the death than be 1x2. I'm not sure any of them expected Lauren to set such a smashing pace.
Yep Kevin, I'm starting to think that Cockburn thought that Avonnova was Smoken Up, there can be no other explanation. If he had allowed Quinny in the death, he would have allowed Avonnova the best possible chance to win or at least run second, & the punters wouldn't have nothing to be complaining about at all. Let's all wait and see what happens this week in the FFA.
I am keen to see which horses are nominated.. Avonnova needs a week off, he was gassed last night! I had a feeling MB would seriously run them along, but I also thought SSL would do something more than what he did. Dragged back to the tail from the very start.. Pointless!
What's amazing to me as well is, to read there are more than a few people(twitter) that believe that Cockburn made the right decision making that suicide move, as if he didn't, he would not even run third.. What utter bollocks! To say that, they must have huge confidence in Quinny having that amazing sprint all the way through sitting in the death, or that Avonnova couldn't track Quinny into the straight.. Now I'm shaking my head as well as scratching... Sorry to repeating myself, but I'm shocked how this could truly be believed...
Chaps, I'm getting a little tired of all the riders in the stand bagging Bart Cockburn's drive, he was clearly driving the horse to his strengths....the horse is "one paced" in this grade and if left in the one one would have finished out of a place, in my opinion, his drive was as good as it could be under the circumstances, obviously the perfect drive is lead and set your own pace, but that was never an option with MB in the race and drawn to lead. And before you all go off half cocked, check out Avonnova's record, in particular his best runs, pay some attention to the sectionals and where he was placed in the field in those races. When you are driving horses in races against opposition that is better than you ( eg IMTQ) you do not have the luxury of using tactical speed, you have to drive your horse to it's strengths, which is exactly what Bart did.
BTW also check out the fact that the horse ran a PB, how could he do that if it was a crook drive?
Cheers,
Dan
Get over it fellas when the top couple of grand circuit horse are fit ( beutide Quinny ) they will alway beat good FFA horses. Remember the co's go 56 in qld all the time , time doesn't mean a lot sometimes .Quinny could have gone another lap
Quinny could have gone another lap for sure with the run that he was gifted with! If Cockburn drove Avonnova to his strengths, he might as well had a serious dip for the lead, as either way he was going to be beaten by certain opinions. I don't buy it! Why wouldn't he keep out Quinny out from the very start since he was hell bent on keeping the death? Lebron was keeping the back of Avonnova easily, so Quinny would have either be 3 wide the trip or use a lot more energy to get the death.
How could he have finished out of a place if had that dream run that Quinny had? The 4th horse finished 4lengths or more back from Avonnova.
I still would like to know if you guys believe Quinny would have won if he was in the death? Or would his task been that much greater? What was the point of SSL being in that race last night? Just for show? GHJ didn't outsmart Cockburn, Cockburn just drove a shocking race!
Evangelos,Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
with all due respect mate, and this will be my last post on this subject, think about sectional times, think about not spending all your pennies in one quarter and think about the other drivers in the field, for example do you honestly think MB was gunna hand up????? Try and take everthing into account, as I suggested earlier do some home work on Avonnova's past performances, I'm beginning to think you might be talking through your pocket old mate.
I don't gamble mate, but I know plenty of people who do and were pissed with Cockburn's drive, which they have every reason to! I just love the trots as well as the dogs. No one has really answered my questions.. Would Quinny have won if he was in the breeze, & if so why? He is not known for his strength/stamina!
Why are a few people so sure that Avonnova would have missed a place if he was in the 1/1? Would STI(not the other type :p have run third or any of the other bunch? So you're pretty much saying here, Cockburn was at very best running for 3rd, & only could have gotten that if he raced the way he did, right? There was no way for him to win or run 2nd? How do we know that LP wouldn't have relented to Cockburn if he kept on going? I would repeat myself again like a parrot and ask, why all week would Cockburn be saying he would not give the death from the START, yet he just allows Quinny to cruise on by, only then to vacate the 1/1 & well you know the rest. Cockburn clearly was talking crap, which a lot of punters were believing in what he was saying. People I spoke to yesterday, were saying they thought the exact same thing, as they believed Cockburn's talk. If he had stayed true to his word, Quinny would have been posted 3 wide the trip, he would have been made to work a lot harder to get the death, & at best he would have earned that race as opposed to basically having it gifted to him. I really can't see how my logic is unreasonable here.
Kev,
sorry I couldnt save you earlier.
In the blue corner:
Cockburn 100+ winners this season.
Quinny only 50 odd wins 3 IDs $4.5 mill
In the red corner:
Evangelos 0 winners this season
"Beautide done a baby bling"
Interesting reading! Not talking out of my pocket, not disrespecting any horses claims to 'champion status', not (trying to) disrespecting anyone else's opinion but it is a no brainer that Avonnova should have kept the death seat which would have provided connections with 2nd place prize money instead of third. Simple as that!
Breno, I know u know your form........tell me u had Quinny crossing (under a hold) to the death seat before the first corner?
Nothing wrong with my posts Brendan, simply my opinions. Post the link so people can read them, have a laugh or whatever mate, it doesn't bother me at all. Why don't you try stick to the topic, that's unless anyone's point of view that doesn't gel with your point if view, isn't worth your time, or should be mocked. No need to be arrogant and rude, but hey, if that's what you feel like, go right ahead. And you shouldn't assume that if anyone has an opinion when they comment on a race, & you view it as sour grapes, does it mean they are gamblers.
Can't a person just share his thoughts? :)
For the record, I will say it for the 2nd time, nobody is bagging Quinny or Cockburn over all! Just questioning his very poor decision LAST NIGHT, not his career or over all character as a person!
How I thought it would pan out is Mach Beauty leading easily with both ITMQ and Suave Stuey Lombo going forward and SSL racing on the outside of MB and Jnr with a sit although I think this may have been a perilous decision because I reckon Panella may have let SSL slide to the front then Tritton would have a double pronged attack SSL in front and MB free access to the sprint lane and I was surprised this didn't eventuate. Avonnova in recent runs has been allowed to settle then taken aroung the field to go to the front or sit outside I think Cockburn thought he could outstay his main oppositition and being somewhat buoyed by his close second to Beautide in the Len Smith Mile he decided to go for it especially after declaring he was ready for this. Avonnova dictated the pace all the way in the Len Smith and was run over by Beautide in 1:53:1 2.6 slower than ITMQ and on a good and bigger track. Gary Hall Snr was right - good strong performer but maybe lacking the sprint ability of the champ.
For what ita worth I thought it was a great race.Hall took no prisoners by going forward at the start to land who knows where.Cockburn took no prisoners by taking off after settling out of the gate.Panella took no prisoners with her hard front running drive.Hall and Quinny got the best out of it..whats the problem?? Perhaps if he didn't win then all the drives would have been great bah Juniors where he would have been shark bait on here not Cockburn!!!
its
Hey Smoken, Fantastic to see the great names from the past, How about we throw Mount Eden in the mix without giving the opposition 60 or 70 metres head start due to his poor manners, That would be some type of race and I'm sure that there would be a massive crowd on hand, We can only dream!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Hi Rob, I thought it was a good drive by Lauren and yes, She couldn't have driven the horse and better, He has blinding gate speed and will win more than his share of races driven this way. I probably should have said Bart should learn something from the experience but it will be tough going not only against Quinny.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Escape Club
Yes Richard, Mt Eden, and so many others from the past. It would be magical, but as you said, we can only dream! So many others that we can mention as well.
Suave Stuey drawn 6 on Sat night over 2138 Mob
Quinn drawn outside him in 7 with Pete McMullen driving.
SSL leads, Quinn in the death if he goes forward again????????????
or does Quinn go back with SSL potentially running track record time?
SSL leads, ITMQ I think will go forward and take cover, to which horse no idea. If Quinny is in death and wins, then he really has toughened up, and I mean big time! So many great races at Albion Park this Sat. Do you think Quinny might try and lead? Very interesting if he does try that..
Why would you give a precious champion rising 10, a hard run in the death when the winner will be lucky to collect $10k?
That could have happened last week Kev, if it wasn't for Cockburn handing Quinny the race. I guess people can say it was worth $60k, sure, still doesn't change he COULD have had a brutal run in the death. Maybe they are confident Quinny is way to good? Should/could Trigger have been given an easier run as a rising 12yr old? That's the difference between the 2 for me. Ones a precious brilliant Champ, and the other one a BRUTAL fighting Champion. I just like the latter's style way more, doesn't mean they both aren't Champs. I'm sure everyone has there fav's for various reasons.
I thought he'd have to go back last week so what do I know. Surely he goes back this Satdy then launches at the 7-800. They will run sub 55 the last 2 qrts leader to winner so it's gonna be touch and go as to whether he puts his head out in front. We won't get to see the most exciting part of the race though as Sky will be panning thru the field down the back straight. Disgraceful!!
Totally agree Brent and I think he's only running to get a bit of fitness. It's a pretty good card up there on Saturday night and will be a huge thrill for P.McMullen driving Quinny. Hopefully Sky is on the ball keeping their eye on SSL and also a very close eye on Quinny if he's coming from the back. It's definitley a race that I wouldn't be taking the short odds on offer and hopefully I'm wrong.
I guess we shall see what transpires this coming Sat. I'm cheering SSL :) :p
No great suprise there !!Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Ironically the horse who I have no doubt altered Cockburns thinking last week.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
SSL COTFF sits in death at Menangle. Next start no COT but is restrained. Had Cockburn known this maybe he keeps death.
Tipping they go forward with SSL this week and he gets an easy lead. As Brent says 55 last half and it's touch and go alright, I reckon SSL wins the trial this week.
The cot rule is the biggest load of crap ever. let drivers, drive and use their own initiative to sum up the situation As it plays out. If stewards can't read a race, they
shouldn't Have a job
Not wanting an argument about the merits of the rule, but whilst the rule is there I would expect it to be used and policed.Quote:
Originally Posted by jackthepunter
But it never is that's why it's a waste of time. Who wants boring racing where people all ready know what will happen. Its pretty Simple if stewards have a problem ask the question.
If stewards cant get one as blatant as SSL they will never get one!Quote:
Originally Posted by jackthepunter
I agree, it like many others rules that are black and white but they only use them when it suits. What's why I say why have these rules.