http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=25232
This up on hrv website today.
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http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=25232
This up on hrv website today.
Did Aiken have any runners at Wedderburn today?Quote:
Originally Posted by Maorisidol
[QUOTE=teecee;39166]Sorry Tony, I quoted it for the second half without even reading it properly - will correct my postQuote:
Originally Posted by Messenger
Interesting to read the UFO website regarding wheel to wheel space.
THE UFO SULKY HAS BEEN OFFICIALLY APPROVED FOR RACING IN AUSTRALIA ,EFFECTIVE 1ST OCTOBER 2012 and NEW ZEALAND , EFFECTIVE 16TH OCTOBER 2012
Human Impact Testing Engineering (NSW) has advised the material used to build the UFO Sulky, is the genuine "military grade" chome moly, and this explains its unique strength, lightweight feature and flexibility.
There are no other Import Sulkies or Australian "copies" that use this specific high grade chrome moly, exclusively. The weight saving characteristics of the UFO, combined with the straighter shaft design, minimal lateral movement, unique offset, places the UFO Sulky way ahead of all its competitors. It has the reputation of "THE FASTEST BIKE ON EARTH", and "48 world records and counting" is certainly no coincidence!
The UFO Sulky has the widest inside wheel to wheel base on the market! The Sulky can be attached all the way in, on the bullet tips, on almost every horse, regardless of size, without concern of interference.
The sulkies in question are wider again!!!!!!!
Go on RSN and listen to what Emma Stewart has to say. Make your own decision on Neal Conder's interview.. Seems as though he's had a few sleepless nights...
Having listened to all interviews, what other option did Neal Conder have? He receives an anonymous call suggesting some carts are outside the rules, tells his gear steward to measure carts on Thursday, when in duty, which he does and has no issues, so there is no reason to think there is a problem, yet when the same Steward is next rostered on and commences the same process at Ballarat, he finds carts outside the rules. The stewards have no room to move here, the carts are illegal. It's far from ideal, but I find it hard to believe that there were not six carts that could have fitted the horses affected without having them hit the struts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Emma Stewart clearly and directly explained the change of cart situation.
In regards to Noel, he was unsure at times of what he was saying,he was contradicting himself, and finally,he admitted in hindsight, he would have gone about it differently. End result IMO, he stuffed up big time! Wouldn't you contact the owners of these carts just to triple check with the owners of these carts a few days before the Ballarat Cup? I mean, he thought there might be some truth/merit to these rumours which normally go unchecked, so why not check before race night? He knew about this rumour mid week last week??
I feel sorry for the Ballarat Harness Club!
I feel for Ballarat as well, but there was no conspiracy here, which if you read some of the comments circulating on Saturday night along the lines of "the stewards knew" etc, clearly they didn't otherwise the situation would have been very different. 20/20 hindsight is great but the way things unfolded the stewards had no other options. I don't buy the argument that other carts could not be found, there were plenty of other legal ufo carts going around on Saturday night. I understand the set up issues, but the heat here should be on the manufacturer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Yep, Ballarat and over all Harness gets the shaft! I still don't understand why he wouldn't contact the owners who owned these carts, since they already know who own them? They SMS owners regarding other issues, so why not this? Do you blame
Emma and Aiken for withdrawing there very high quality horses?
I think he explained his position very well, everyone wants a scapegoat, but apart from performing a routine check, they had no evidence other than a tip off to suggest that they were likely to find a problem and had tested three on Thursday and found no problems with those tested. Given the explosion in new age carts, these days I think it is not likely that they knew who was using what. There are so many that all look relatively similar. They certainly don't have a register of who has what cart. 5 years ago it was either Regals or Challengers, now? Who knows?Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
It is the trainers prerogative to do what they want, but I don't buy the argument that they could not have borrowed and adjusted other carts, plenty of legal ufo's or doozy' or whatever were there. The focus should be on the manufacturer who sold equipment that is clearly illegal and not what was approved by the HRA.
I respect your opinion, but I disagree. If he thought the rumour warranted enough to be checked on Thursday, why wouldn't he avoid any potential major drama by contacting the owners with these carts.. Why simply check them on Sat night? They didn't even check them on Friday night @ Melton. I thought Emma explained herself fantastically.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister JayKO
Same sentiments to the Ballarat Club.
A few things that were surprising from the radio interviews
- didn't disclose whether all horses scratched were to use the illegal sulkies
- West Aust notified similarly without discovering any illegal sulkies
- one of the affected trainer's from Saturday night had their sulky measured on Thursday and found to conform, but the sulky to be used on Saturday night, when measured on Saturday night, did not
What's equally surprising is when the steward was measuring the sulkies on Thursday not one person was curious enough to ask why.
And I respect yours as well, but given the circumstances, it's just a perfect storm. I am disappointed by the comments of some of the industry participants which want to turn a very unfortunate situation into an us and them scenario. I am not blaming the trainers for scratching their horses (though I remain unconvinced of the reasons). At the end of the day it is another shot in the foot for the game and there aren't too many feet left to keep shooting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Yes, it makes harness look second rate! It's already considered shady over all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arlington
Read the stewards report, approximate 10 horses scratched due to sulky issues.
None of the sulkys measured on Thursday were found to be illegal, they were not the same Trainers sulky that were found to be illegal on Saturday night. I don't think your comment is accurate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister JayKO
G'day Stu,
Which particular part of my comment is inaccurate?
I was hoping the interviews would clarify if all horses scratched from the cup were in fact going to use the illegal sulkies. Comments appearing on social media suggested some horses were scratched for other reasons but still due to the illegal sulky issue.
I should have clarified, not all affected trainers scratched their horses in every event. Pretty sure the Chairman of Steward said on radio one of the trainers who did compete on Saturday night with a change of sulky had a sulky measured on Thursday which complied. Not suggesting it was the same sulky.
Now seeing the steward's report, all six horses scratched from the cup were going to use the sulkies in question.
This bit's not specifically relevant to the radio interviews or your post Stu,
What's equally surprising is when the steward was measuring the sulkies on Thursday not one person/participant/trainer/driver was curious enough to ask why. After all the onus is on the owner of the sulky to ensure it complies. You'd have to be curious as to why an official was running a tape measure over your bike...wouldn't you?
If these sulkies are oversized beyond Aust standards, then the manufacturer has supplied an illegal product imo. They must be held accountable, unless they are special orders and can prove it.
If the manufacturer is at fault, then it will be found out, but that still doesn't explain the unprofessionalism on what happened on Sat night. This all could have been prevented, from that Thursday that they decided for some strange reason to look into this rumour. Did they forget that more trainers use these sulkys, and the big guns would be using them on Sat night?
Yep, I'm sounding like a parrot, but just because they are stewards, that doesn't mean they did not use common sense on Sat night, because & they didn't thoroughly investigate this rumour! If you investigate it, you might as well do it thoroughly, not just on some sulkys.
I wonder if this rumour was true, how many other rumours could be true, but HRV brush them off... Why did this tip off warrant for it to be looked at, even though very poorly.
Makes you seriously wonder! Harness will be last of the racing codes for many years to come at this rate!
I'm not quite understanding why the trainers in this situation aren't copping more of a spray. Granted, the whole situation was very unpleasant, especially for the club, but aren't these trainers training as their livelihood? How on gods earth they could put themselves in a position like this by using equipment that is non-conforming is unfathomable to me. If team Adam Scott step onto the course with 15 clubs, they get penalised.....do they blame Tietlist, I don't think so.
p.s as much of a debacle as it was on Satdy night, the goings on in Sydney town certainly do put things in perspective.
Quote:
Originally Posted by brent_L
Totally agree
I believe given the resources available (very limited) the did what they should have done by investigating a line of enquiry at the first available opportunity - Thursday - found nothing and given that result were not alarmed. Had they found one on Thursday different story. The number of rumours that stewards receive are significant, they have to use some judgement as to what resources they employ and what they check out vs what they don't. Har does not have the resources of the gallops, but it's no surprise that some of the best gallops stewards came from the trots. Most participants would not understand the large number of jobs performed by stewards on race day - it is significant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Credit to them that they kept going at the next available opportunity and found something. Participants are required to play within the rules, Trainers have a responsibility to race horses in approved gear. Not the stewards fault here in my opinion.
Stu, if you were the head steward, and this came to your attention, would you double check these claims, especially since it's a few days out from some very big name horses running in the Ballarat Cup, who also happen to run in these carts? It's fine to say rules are rules, but if the head steward/stewards can't look into a claim thoroughly, since they obviously deem it to be worthwhile to be looked at in the first place, then it all becomes messy and the integrity becomes even messier. Like I said before, out of so many rumours or tip offs that are given, for some reason they clearly believed this rumour to may have some merit behind it. They simply didn't do there job properly to rule out any truth to the rumour. The Thursday check up over several or so sulkys was enough for them.. Come Sat night, they were left with egg on there face, and the loser out of all of this was the fantastic Ballarat club. Stewards need to enforce common sense in the rule book!
Macaw Evan :p
Unfortunately, I understand time and resources, given what was available I am 100% comfortable with the route they followed, particularly given the rumour was received from an anonymous source. The trainers need to wear some blame, they brought and had been racing in illegal equipment. The egg was on the face of everyone because it was a major night for the industry. Once the stewards detected the carts were outside 1.3M they had no room to move, their is no discretion allowed. Neal Conder was at pains to say they had no information to suggest that they would find illegal carts - but they did. We now need to find out how and why these carts came into being.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
You mention resources , yet it could have taken a simple SMS to notify the trainers who use these carts. That's not very hard to do, considering they sms them for other issues, & the Ballarat meeting that was coming up, should have made them that little more thorough in there investigation. They should have taken the rumour seriously or not bother with the little check up on the track on Thursday. They had plenty of time. It backfired on them now, plain and simple!
So that's what happened to my Sunflowers hey lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smoken
Too many sunflower seeds are bad for a bird - they are like their chocolate (guessing this is the link between sunflowers and Ev's strange Macaw sign off)
http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=25240
Statement from hra today.
That explains a lot Nathan
http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=25240
Harness Racing Australia (HRA) has been advised by Stewards in Victoria that a number of 'UFO Alien' sulkies have been identified that do not conform to the HRA Sulky Standards in that they are wider than the maximum allowed width of 1300m.
.......
The Committee considered the information provided by Stewards as well as correspondence provided by the UFO Sulky representative in Australia, Mr Frank Ranaldi.
It was determined that in the interests of all industry participants, the 'UFO Alien' sulky approval be temporarily suspended, effective immediately - prohibiting the ordering, sale and delivery of such sulkies without the express written permission of HRA.
It is important to note that this decision does not restrict the use of existing 'UFO Alien' sulkies which meet the HRA Sulky Standard measurements requirements. These can continue to be used in the usual manner.
http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=25240
http://www.harnesslink.com/Internati...mours-straight
If this is already posted in another thread sorry haven't seen it.
"Our steward who observes gear was rostered on Thursday and checked several sulkies, which all cleared, his next rostered meeting just happened to be Ballarat on Saturday night, which had nothing to do with who was at the track and who wasn’t.”Quote:
Originally Posted by Race For Fun
http://www.harnesslink.com/Internati...mours-straight
Shouldn't all stewards observe gear? If there is only one 'specializing?' in that area, a trainer or driver wanting to try something outside the rules could wait until he is not officiating. I do not think this has been the case with the over sized sulkies - just pointing out a massive gap. I simply don't buy the excuse for there being no measuring done on Friday, nor the lack of communication/warning from stewards to participants
Stewards are sparse because of funding, the industry doesn't have the funds it needs, on race days Stewards are flat chat doing the other integrity checks. Only when there are three on are additional things like this done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Messenger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister JayKO
Yep that's right. But if the participants were alerted when it was found out last Wednesday (instead of this Monday), they could have measured their own. Pretty easy to do these days. Website, twitter, facebook, SMS, etc.
Then this farce wouldn't have happened.
Maybe for just one Friday they could have given one of them a tape measure - nothing beats flexibility and common senseQuote:
Originally Posted by Mister JayKO
I missed In The Gig - anyone?
Just read an article from The Courier Mail and Anderson is seeking approval for carts up to 1400mm wide.
They're in summer recess, so only old stories. Hence no comment on the fiasco.Quote:
Originally Posted by Messenger
Getting the public back......after the cup disaster.. From today's Ballarat Courier.
BALLARAT and District Trotting Club chief executive Paul Rowse says the club is pleased with plans being mooted in a bid to win back patrons to Bray Raceway.
Rowse said Harness Racing Victoria, in conjunction with the Association of Victorian Country Harness Racing Clubs, would put forward an application to the Office of Liquor, Gaming and Racing to create a bumper Boxing Day meeting.
The idea is hoped to give something back to those who were left short-changed by Saturday night’s developments, where six horses were scratched from the Ballarat Pacing Cup following a crackdown by stewards on sulky dimensions.
“The proposed activities put forward would definitely be very favourable for our club and to patrons that could potentially be on course Boxing Day night,” Rowse said.
Details on the exact offerings are expected in the coming days. Rowse said repercussions in gambling from Saturday night’s events were felt mainly within the area of on-course turnover.
( Of course the on course figure would suffer....would you bet on the 4 horse field?)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Messenger
Kev, before the all clear is given at the races, jockeys weigh in with their saddles. Perhaps before the all clear is given at the trots, measuring the width of the sulky could be part of the process for the first 4. Seriously how long would it take to run a tape measure over them or just have a length of wood or something, pre-cut to 1300mm?
The pre-cut sounds like a good idea Rob. Stu has made me conscious of Stewards time/commitments so I wonder whether we could get away with them just doing it to the winner. I know it would seem more correct to do the first 4 but by singling out the winner (a bit like swabbing) we would instantly see all trainers making sure they were within the limit.
They will all be within the limit if they allow the 1400mm width rule through, so there's s great start! At least they have learnt this, we live in an age of very easy communication via-sms-email-social media-mobile phones, so trying one of these options in the future would/could save a very disappointing situation to arise.