http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=93854
smoken up loosing last tuesday through spanner in the works,
If he won would have already been invited yet the winner of
that race has not should have been invited on that run
I thought Terror to Love was invited last Tuesday. Thats why he didn't start today
only 3 invited Smoken Up,Raglan, Im Themightyquin
Greg, this appeared in NZ Press on Wednesday
"Instead the Courts and McDonald waited anxiously by their phones last night for an invitation to the Miracle Mile in Sydney. It came and they gratefully accepted the opportunity for another shot at a big money race in the same month".
Well yeah that source and another NZ source http://www.mobilerolling.com/ say Terror To Love has been given an invitation (although it says excepted and not accepted). But nothing on HRNSW, Harness.org or Harnesslink confirms this.Quote:
Originally Posted by p plater
This article says that Smoken Up, ITMQ and Raglan are the only ones in the field. http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=17114
I think Terror To Love should get an invite; in fact I think it's crazy he hasn't got one if that's the case. But one thinks the NZ media and/or his connections are up to tricks trying to get him an invite....
It will be very exciting to see ITMQ wind up in that long straight.
Breno , read this. Terror To Love has not been invited http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=93920
I honestly cant see how Smoken Up gets an invite and not terror to love. I mean look at the NZ Cup Smoken Up had an easy run. I'm still amazed how he lost. He made them go a slow time and still cant beat a 4 year old that got pushed to the back twice, was about 8 wide coming round the turn and still beat Smoken Up home. I guess there was no DMSO or whatever it was this time.
Nz Cup winner should automatically receive an invite. Why not put the best kiwi horse in the race?
It's an Australian race. NZ have no automatic right to an invite. If they invite Soken Up then they have invited the winner of NZ's leading sprint race to their leading sprint race. It just so happens that he is the fastest sprinter in this part of the world. That leaves them with more options for invites now with 3 automatic invite races.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterK
"We think we've got the best horse that raced at the cup carnival, Smoken Up." ..... umm who beat who again???
Hey if Terror to Love had of backed up in the FFA hey may have beaten Smoken Up. The precedent for many years now is to invite the winner of the NZ Cup. Just because the race is run in Australia doesnt mean it is only Australian horses. Similar to how Smoken Up races in the New Zealand cup. Maybe they should change the system from where some races winners have automatic invites back to the NSW team inviting the best 8 horses. I mean raglan is no where near as good as Terror To Love
I seem to remember the NZ Cup champion being a kiwi not an Australian. I mean I could be wrong but I was at Addington watching the race. I mean wouldnt the NZ Cup champion be the best horse? Not the horse that won the FFA.Quote:
Originally Posted by teecee
And anyway Smoken Up, once again, did not perform in the NZ Cup. I mean they went slow he went to the front and walked them for 2 laps and got out sprinted home. The one time Lance Justice drives him properly and still he cant win. Maybe try again next year?
Terror to Love racing in Cordina Sprint on Saturday night at Menangle Park. Here's his chance to show how good a miler he is.
Kurt,
In years past NZ cup winners were invited. Any invitations were always at the discretion of the directors of the NSWHRC. As the NZ Cup is such a big race the winner, moreso in recent years got an invite. This year there was a change of programming whereby it was announced that the only assured positions were given to the winners of 3 sprint races run I'm Australia, The Newcastle Mile, The Coca Cola and The Cordina. The directors then had discretionary options to invite a few and then make the field up from those that took part but did not win the qualifying races. Raglan came and conquered the mile at Newcastle, so in similar fashion, Terror To Love gets an opportunity to qualify, and perhaps gain a spot even if he doesn't win but Aquits himself well....the conditions were well known to all...
Fred
You are correct that there was a change of programming and it was announced early for connection's wanting to gain a start in the Miracle Mile, but for me i don't think you are going to get the best 8 horses in the race. I have nothing against Raglan or anyone invloved with the horse but to be honest with you he is not a Miracle Mile horse and would of been lucky to be in the top 10 horses in N.Z but that's just my opinion. I would like to see both 4yr old's Terror To Love and Bitobliss get a start as they are up and comming grand circuit horses. The other thing i find strange is that they have put these sprints on to show case Menangle park and so on but then they change the Inter so heats are run in every state go figure.
Fred I understand the change of conditions. I just dont see why you wouldnt invite the best horses. You would have to say Terror To Love deserves more of a spot than even Smoken Up at this point. Smoken up really hasnt proved a lot to me this campaign.
Even if the conditions have changed after the run Terror To Love had in the NZ Cup h should be an automatic starter. if you swapped him and Smoken Ups runs you can almost guarenttee Smoken Up would not have gone anywhere near as good as he did.
Its a race that should include the best 8 horses in Australasia and thats not what its turning out to be
On prior form 100% agree, but hard to say that now after he ran past Mr Feelgood.Quote:
Originally Posted by mango
What you say about Inter is spot on.
Yes Fred the conditions were known to all and one condition was the NZ Cup winner may get an invite.Quote:
Originally Posted by doinmabest
I don't know what possible explanation connections of Terror To Love can get that justifies why they didn't get an invite yet Smoken Up did.
Yes Smoken Up deserves one; mile record holder and defending Mile champion but after what happened 7 days ago I don't know how you can say no to Terror To Love.
As it is this week in the Cordina just about all horses have tried and failed 1 or 2 times in their quest for an invite so it would be hard to justify giving those horses a discretionary spot.
The format I am a fan of. Because I thought with the plain print where it says horses who contest lead up races would be given preference would avoid situations where people are crying about Special Albert and Rohan Home being included in the field (eg past 'weak' Newcastle Mile winners) or where in the days leading up to the final field selection it would avoid a Make Mine Cullen V Melpark Major issue like last year. I thought the system would be used as a tool in selecting the final 2 or 3 spots; not as a tool to say no to a horse that clearly deserves a spot.
The point is that the race is by INVITATION for at least 5 runners and it is upto the NSWHRC to invite whoever they choose. Winning the NZ Cup, which incidently I too saw won by Terror to Love is not one of the automatic entry races. I shan't go back too far in the history of both great races but I do remember Young Quinn being invited even though not winning a NZ Cup.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterK
He was invited because that's who the NSWHRC wanted to invite and he duly won.
IMO not since the days of SIX starters only has there been a MM field of the very best pacers available.
"The best 8 horses" is always going to be a matter of opinion. Whether it is solely through invitations at the discretion of the directors or via the route the club has created this year there will always be people who feel a better horse missed out. No system is perfect and that is why we end up with this same tired conversation every year. You will never please everyone, and in some will never be pleased at all.
At the end of the day the NSWHRC put on an invitational event at a high cost to themselves. They should be able to pick and choose whoever they feel is appropriate. In all seriousness, you could not leave out a horse who ran 1.48 and change at that track only 7 months prior. With Smoken Up and ITMQ invited the race is assured of Australiasia's best two performers over the last 12 months. They have earned their passage, the rest can do the same and best of luck to them. I hope this Staurday that Terror To Love unleashes a last quarter like he did last Tuesday and makes it into the MM. What a race it will be.
Hi Brendan,Quote:
Originally Posted by aussiebreno
Yes as usual, you are spot on...One of the clauses indicates that one Invite MAY be given after the running of the NZ Cup. It doesnt mention the invitation going to the winner. I just read the conditions again on the meeting calendar on Harness.org and the invitation to ITMQ, though in my opinion is a good one for the race, doesn't meet the published conditions. BELOW
An event open to a maximum eight Pacers (exclusive of Reserves).The winner of the Newcastle Mile, Coca Cola - Amatil Sprint, Cordina Sprint, receive automatic invitations if accepted by the connections. One invitation may be given after the running of the New Zealand Cup, all other invitations will be issued by the Directors of the NSWHRC but only from horses who competed in the Newcastle Mile, Coca Cola - Amatil Sprint and Cordina Sprint. Reserves (if any) drawn with the invited Pacers)
Now I did hear that one invite would be totally discretionary,(but couldn't see that anywhere). If that was the case it explains why ITMQ was invited (discretionary) SU (got the NZ Cup invite) and the rest come from the 3 sprints......HOWEVER... if SU got the discretionary spot (and given his record should have, IMO) where did the invite for ITMQ come from........
I think no matter what, we all concede on it's NZ Cup win TTL deserves a crack.
Fred, my reading of that condition is that it refers to the timing of the invitation, not the race where the invited horse will come from. Which is why the rest of the condition reads "horses who competed in". Might be my misinterpretation.Quote:
Originally Posted by doinmabest
I agree regarding TTL. I would love to see him here.
I too would love to see Terror To Love in there however simply to say because he won the NZ Cup he should be there is rubbish. Smokin Up is a obvious choice he has ran the fastest mile down our way, he has proved time and time again he's a champion. Terror To Love has raced over the sprint distance about 4-5 times and won once in about a 58 mile rate.
Yes in a perfect world all the above horses would be in and what a race it would be but it is a invitation race and if there is no invitation coming your way then so be it. For 20 years I waited for a invitation to join the All Blacks - it never arrived. As Paul Court said, "I am gutted". :mad:
Never Give Up Ray...Never Give up....
LOL
Weather / barrier draw permitting , does anyone think that Smoken Up's 1:48.5 Australasian record will be lowered in the Miracle Mile?
Don't have a problem with the Board deciding that horses have to compete in a lead up mile race to be considered for selection, with one exception. Don't have a problem with that exception being the current title holder and NZ FFA winner. Not sure how the conditions allow two exceptions though. Maybe I'm misreading the conditions?
Absolutely a big chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by David Summers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Corleone
Wow, an unbiased NZ'er, now I've seen everything! Could not agree with your comments more Ray. Yes Terror to Love beat Smoken Up in the NZ Cup, but the NZ cup is a full field of runners over 3200 metres in comparison to the 8 starters and 1609 metres of the Miracle Mile, they're chalk and cheese. Smoken Up is the defending Miracle Mile champion, and is the only horse to break a 1.50 mile in winning in the southern hemisphere. For anyone to think Terror To Love deserved a invite over Smoken up has no idea.
At the end of the day I don't really see the big deal here. Terror To Love will race in the Cordina Sprint on Saturday night, if he wins, he gets an invite into the mile, if he runs a place, he will be considered for an invite, and if he misses a place it'll prove Dumesney and the rest of the NSWHRC board correct in not issuing him an invite in the first place.
[VVV] Tony, are you sure you're a Kiwi? :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by teecee
You're right Eric. I don't think that NSWHRC can lose , no matter how TTL runs in the Cordina Sprint. BTW , I hope he wins or if not , is invited anyway :-) He is real class.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rainmaker
What? You've totally contradicted yourself there. Smoken Up has ran 2nd s and a 3rd at his last three attempts at the NZ Cup and is the fastest horse in the Southern Hemishere. How is that chalk and cheese? Both TTL and SU should have immediately received an invite after the NZ Cup. It would be a travisty if TTL loses on Sturday night and misses a start in the Miracle Mile. What will NSWHRC do then?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rainmaker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky Camilla"s Lovechild
I dont see how I have contradicted myself at all. A 3200m standing start race to a 1609m mobile race is chalk and cheese is anyones language. Smoken Up is brilliant enough and adaptable enough to be competitive in the top class over both starts types and distances, his record shows that. However Terror To Love's records show he has only won the one race over a mile, and all his recent form is over standing start races over 2400m +, so why should that constitute an automatic invite for the Miracle Mile? They don't give an invite to the Melbourne Cup winner in the thoroughbred world to compete in the Cathay Pacific Hong Kong sprint.
I hope he is as good over the mile as you think he may be because the Miracle Mile could do with an X factor and a NZ representative for some more excitment, but I can hardly see how it would be a travesty if he missed a place in the Cordina sprint on Saturday and failed to gain an invite. If the horse cant place against that field on Saturday night in the Cordina sprint then how the hell can it win the Miracle Mile against a stronger field the following week?
If they decided to drive Terror To Love a bit 'ugly' over the Mile he would be something to contend with...I've no doubt about that. Genuine stayers always are.
Yeah if he gains a start I wouldn't be surprised to see him in the mix. A long straight and fast pace will ensure everything gets their chance. Not trying to get the NZ'ers here off side with my posts above, but I think it was the right call not to issue an invite to him soley on his NZ cup win, I'm not for a second doubting the horse's ability itself. For what its worth I think he'll place on Saturday night and gain an invite, therefore a lot of conjecture here over nothing.
Does he have any open age form in fast run races?Quote:
Originally Posted by triplev123
Of course a 3200m standing start is different to a 1609m mobile! But the same horses run in these 2 types of races, unlike the thoroughbreds. And yes, he should give a good account of himself on Saturday night, if not win it. But what if he gets skittled. Does NSWHRC make hippocrites of themselves and put him in anyway?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rainmaker
And what about Highview Tommy? His run in the NZ Cup was actually more impressive than TTL's. No clamouring for a run for him?
TTL may have only won one 1609m race but you must remember he is only 4. Smoken Up is what 10? how many attempts has he had at running over the mile unlike TTL whos only had a few
Looking at Smoken Up's record at Menangle Park over the mile, it appears he's had 7 starts for 5 wins and 2 2nds. All bar one in group 1 status races.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterK
He has 4 sub 1.51 wins including the 1.48.5 at his last start there..........No wonder the Club wants him there