Heard today that in NSW there will be a cut of 54 meeting's in the next season 12/13 .
Has anybody else heard, what's the reasoning behind it ?
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Heard today that in NSW there will be a cut of 54 meeting's in the next season 12/13 .
Has anybody else heard, what's the reasoning behind it ?
Hi Greg
I have heard the same thing, i also heard the Gallops are having some of there meeting's cut. Not sure as to how much truth is behind it ????
Hi Greg
Don't look at this move by Sam and his team badly it is probably one of the best moves he's made. The 54 meetings removed will all be restricted meetings the lowest form of racing known to man.
For harness racing to move forward the sport needs to profesionalize removing the favored meetings of the weekend worrier trainer is a smart move to wipe them out. Just take a look at the last a bulli and you will know what I mean. People who can't count past four are not a good look.
Hello Andy
If you dont like restricted meetings, Dont bet on them. Simple as that. Personally I will only race there if they are down the road, because they are not value for effort.
With regard to your comment "weekend worrier trainer ", please dont insult part time professionals who supply the fields that make up the harness racing product. Many of them are more professional than the so called "Professionals" who keep coming up with positive swabs. Possibly the recent sales were down because these were the professionals who stayed away through a lack of confidence in the current state of the industry
Probably to make way for the prizemoney increases. Deleting the restricted meetings should make dog food cheaper as the knackeries will be doing booming business.
In criticising those who can't count past four it would have been a good idea, either as a professional or a weekend warrior, to get spelling right and give pronouns a capital.Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
The winners have to beat somebody - not everybody can claim trainers premierships. I imagine some of these 54 meetings may include meetings from Leeton, Temora, Albury etc. Those places get more of a crowd to one meeting than Menangle/Melton would get to 20 meetings. Let's drive away all those fans...
You can have your premier competition (eg Menangle/AFL/NRL) work alongside amateurs (eg Temora/country footy leagues). You don't need to get rid of amateurs to be professional.
That will do me...........that is the most ridiculous statement I have ever heard!!!!!.......do this and you virtually kill the sport completely.......these "weekend warriors" are what keeps this game alive.........there are not a lot of people making a living out of harness racing.......Please have a look at the below post regarding the Blayney meeting held recently.........a lot of these tracks and meetings are looked after by volunteers and they are still going........some have dropped out, because financial support was not forthcoming..........!!!!!!!!!. your comment can't be serious!Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
Re mistaking the laps at Bulli, it won't be the first or the last.......your memory must be short because a little over 12 months ago, GARY HALL JR, MISTOOK THE LAPS.........HE IS DRIVING THE 1/1 FAVOURITE IN THIS WEEKS ID FINAL.
Looking Back
I think everyone left Blayney last Saturday feeling that the meeting had been a success.
Haven't seen the official figures but have been told that the Tote held over $12,000 on the day, the bookies held over $10,000. Gate was $1,300 and the canteen took in $2,100 running out of everything just prior to the last.
Heard some comments during the day that there were more people at Blayney than at Menangle the previous night and that the crowd was bigger than most Wednesdays at Bathurst. The racing was a bit rough and ready which is to be expected with the grade of horses competing, but a few good ones showed everyone how it should be done :)
Everyone is now excited about the upcoming Carnival of Cups meeting where the increased prizemoney will see better horses making the journey to Blayney.
G'day Steve,
In Jnr's defence, there have in fact been quite a few drivers over the years that have mistaken a longer race for a shorter one. Without naming names one of the long-time leading reinsman/trainers from Tassie has done it as for that matter has one of the, without any doubt, all-time great drivers from VIC. Those two guys would definitely be in the Australian Harness Racing Horseman's Hall Of Fame if we had one. It can happen, even to the best of them.
IMO most are over Tinys work on here , not many agree with his writings of utter crap .Quote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
Triple......The quote from tiny was referring to the driver who mistook the laps in the Trotters in the last race at Bulli on Saturday night........my point was that any driver can do this and mentioned the topical driver of the moment G Hall JR!Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple V
I don't know the driver personally, but they are a battling trainer of well over 25 years and has had limited success, but they keep trying and coming back.........they were always asking questions to find ways to improve........on a few occasions they would speak to the late John Binskin about their horse in a trial, and he would give advise freely about ways to improve etc........everybody is continually learning no matter what level they are at! I am sure the driver is embarrassed about the situation.......and the stewards will find accordingly!
Ok. I've misread who said what. Sorry.
I watched the race on Sky live and immediately saw the laps had been mistaken, as had Fred Hastings, the caller, but he did not make a big deal about! What a great diplomat for the sport! These things do happen!
I can't say on here what i think of your comment Tiny for i would be barred but in a nutshell your comment is bordering on stupidity IMO . How many professional's are there in the sport in NSW ? What keep's the game going here is the hobbyist and the die hard supporter's that like to watch and train their horse race regardless of the class.Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
Just adding my two cents, and I've said it before, in country NSW the grassroots does not deserved to be shunned, just because the the metropolitan people want to be more professional. The smaller towns turn out in droves for their better meetings and when the big boys turn up to 'steal' the money the locals always give a good account of themselves. I am gutted that I no longer have a little track to attend anymore since leaving the central west 15 years ago but I still enjoy watching those little meetings via Sky. Go the country meetings!!! And go Blayney!!!
G'day Andy,Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
you are entitled to your opinion and, like everyone else you are fully entitled to voice that opinion.
As a long term hobbyist in this game I was appalled at your immeasurably narrow minded views about who are worthy participants in this game and who should be "wiped out".
I believe the subsequent responses to your beautifully articulated rant have adequately answered the shortcomings of your views.
Good luck with the leadership aspirations Tiny, can I suggest your wasting your time but keep at it mate!!
Cheers,
Dan
I sorry that most of you don't like what i’m saying. Harness racing is facing some tough times ahead and at the end of the day harness racing is a business and the racing is the product they sell. It is simple if harness racing doesn't grow its betting turnover, it will go bust. I can understand the emotion attached.
The comment by Daryl New that if you don’t like it don’t bet on it, is not good enough. Betting turnover can’t grow if the punters don’t like the product. So It is more of a case if you don’t like it its got to improve or be got rid of.
Daryl also wrote don’t bag the people that make up the fields and this only highlights the problem, if there are people or horses that are only going around week in week out to make up numbers is a problem. No one will back a horse they have never herd of with bad form that is trained a driven by some bloke that has a nine to five job and drives or trains a horse after work. Get half a dozen of these in a race and the punter doesn’t punt.
As a punter there are four things I follow, Horses, trainers, drivers and form if I look at a race and don’t know any names and nothing obvious in the form you don’t punt.
In recent time harness racing has had its share of integrity issues again causing a lack of trust in the product. Because the industry is so large and fragmented makes it hard to be correctly regulated.
I have wrote this before but the number of trainers must be reduced if harness racing had 10 trainers in Sydney with about 70-80 horses each regulation would be simple there would be better name recognition and plenty of quality horses to make up fields. The same can be said about drivers although more than ten are required.
As much as it is a hard decision to make it is for the better of the sport and doing away with the restricted meetings is a good one and a good step towards a stronger future.
The comment I made earlier about the Bulli race was wrong in the way it targeted one person but the point was all drivers have shockers but the part time ones have more than the ones that drive all the time.
PS sorry about the spelling I was never very good at it. But must also add I have never commented on anyone’s spelling ever. So I can’t spell but I’m not a hypocrite.
You can still have your professionals but not at the expense of amateurs.Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
10 pros and 10 amateurs are better than 10 pros and no amateurs.
Tiny, let's talk hypothetically now, would you like to nominate the 10 professional trainers who would head your list at the moment???
CENTRALISED MODELQuote:
Originally Posted by tiny
So Andy, you are selling the idea of a centralised model. I've got a few questions for you after you nominate your ideal top 10.
1. How can every horse in a race have good form? What do you define as good form? Are you talking about runners having less variation i.e. more consistency in their form?
2. If you've got only 10 trainers then it's likely that many of them will have mutiple runners in a 10 horse race. The punters by your comments will have a new challenge on which horse to pick. i.e. like the challenge at the moment when Luke McCarthy has 3 or 4 runners in a race. Are they going to be put off when the favoured runner from the stable loses?
3. What similar sport has your suggested model worked in?
Hypothetically speaking I would like to see Luke McCarthy cloned ten times an take all of the top ten positions. He is every thing and more than you would expect from a professional trainer.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
He presents his horses well
They always run to expectation
He presents himself well with the media marketing himself and his sponcers at every opportunity.
And the fact he doesn't punt or allow his staff to punt is an added bonus.
In a time when harness racing was not scared of its own shadow Luke would be marketed better by the industry similar to the way Chris Gleeson was in the 90s.
Tiny, if I did not know better, I would think you are pulling my leg.......but I know your not........I was going to suggest for you L Mc X 10, but I waited for you to reply.........What if he gets sick or suspended, or has a positive swab......what will happen to Harness Racing?...........As a punter, I hate good horses and big races....you can find more winners at better prices in the "penny dreadful" events........you just have to dig a little deeper.........I like Luke Mcarthy also, but he can't carry Harness Racing on his own shoulders.........He does do a good job, and I like his manner and no BS approach........he has other trainers and drivers wondering what to do next.......but in general his horses are a short price...........this does not do the sport any good either......more competitive racing is better for the sport.......owners are queuing up to give him horses, that's why he has multiple runners in each race....... he can't take all the horses out their to train..........I like finding something to beat him, it it happens i get good odds!............Stick with Luke, you will find the winner more often than not!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
In 30 years who then takes over training from the 10 trainers when they are all ageing??? No-one has been groomed or allowed to learn the trade.Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
Luke McCarthy wouldn't have been around to be a top10 trainer, his old man may still have been out bush as a butcher (John was a butcher by trade IIRC) in NSW if you were in charge of any harness admin and your main man Luke never would have got the oppurtunity.
Tiny give it a break.
So onto the top ten:Quote:
Originally Posted by racefair
Luke McCarthy
Paul Fitzpatric
Blake Fitzpatric
Peter Russo
Steve Turnbull
Darin Hancock
Robie Morris / Kerriann
David Thorn
Next two are up for grabs but I would like to see Todd or Andy McCarthy make there way to Nsw as well.
The point if every horse having good form is not sensible. To have good betting races you want consistently performing horses with mixed form. Not runners with picket fences that start at $1.10 and not horses with a nest of duck eggs that start at $200. I'm talking open races of consistant horses.
Trainers with multiple runners in races is only a problem when they team drive. When Luke had multiple runner I take the quinela or trifecta an quite often get up.
I think the centralized model has served the TB industry well most horses in work are attached to a track or training facility making stable inspections and monitoring of trackwork easy. You must admit the TB haven't had the integrity issues that harness have had.
I would love to here some other people's ideas to improve harness racing as well as shooting mine down.
If Luke gets suspended or sick you just do what everyone does and transfer the horses to a family member stable Forman however.
Your idea is ludicrous. You don't make ideas for the sake of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
On your list you will find that most are descendants of trotting families.....the passing on of the knowledge and skills down the line........harness racing needs to attract and give opportunities to the new unkowns, and give them a level playing field to compete against these families........some do fight their way through........if you want better racing, encourage more people into the sport and the results should follow........but it will take time........and who is doing something about it.....I don't see advertised, training and driving courses for new aspirants.......where is the promotion.......Get some trainers and drivers to help visit schools or hold courses...........However, it is a simple model at the moment, go over to NZ and buy performed horses.........., as long as you have the money......you are halfway there!Quote:
Originally Posted by tiny
The more you guys humour this troglodyte the worse he's gunna get
Danno, I think tiny is more like the "one-eyed" footy fan.........L Mc is carving them up at the moment........and he wants to win also........he may work for the stable or knows someone who does........at least he stands up for his view.....I won't take that away from him!Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno
To a certain degree you're right Steve, I'm just not conviced that there is anything of any real value being gained for anyone other than our learned friend here, thats all. Personally I don't even find it funny, and thats saying something 'cos I can usually get a cackle out of ALMOST anything!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
Take your point, no more for me to say on the subject...........
You like humour........did you like my best bet for Bankstown trots thread today........tell me it was funny?
Thought the other half of your quinella was extremely unlucky not to have been able to leave the gate yesterday.. would certainly have paid off if not for this small infraction.
No, Im Tilly Devine.......don't you watch Underbelly............the madam from Kings X & Beaver........thought they were the topical quinella for the race!Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno
you got me in, I dont watch a lot of telly....I had two hundred on that 'nella 'cos i thought you were fair dinkum !!! ha haQuote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
There was even a Madam Devine in the 2YO........looks like trots fans watch Underbelly! Why I wonder????
Aspirations? Tips? Catch up family history?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
Yes all of those!........plus keep in touch with friends etc!Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno
Any coincidence with the venue Steve? I think its a dead giveaway meself!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Form Student
Back on track
State wide losing 54 meeting's
Metro incl Bulli and HRNSW@TPC 18,Bankstown-11 down from 20 & 21
Hunter and north west - 4 - 2 each from Newc and Tam
Western District's - 10 - Dubbo 3,Orange 2 and Parkes 5
South West & Riverina - 9- Junee 3, Temora 3,Wagga 3 and Young 2
But gaining 2 extra at Goulburn.
Goulburn is being classed as 1/2 Metro and 1/2 South west and Riverina gaining 2 in 2013 from 8 to 10
No coincidence, this is reality at its best......we have kept this forum going all night......just had someone thanks us for the entertainment!........Tomorrow could be a different scenario.........what is around the corner!........back to reality!Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno