Luke McCarthy Appeal

[Thevoiceofreason]

Here is something I posted back in early October on the Luke McCarthy thread.

I was considered mad for thinking that Luke McCarthy might have a defense similar to the one he was actually using.

"It took 18 months for Racing NSW stewards to even charge Gai Waterhouse over her Boldenone positive in 2007, let alone the appeal.

HRNSW stewards are well inside this time frame, this is now the appeal stage and McCarthy is entitled to mount a strong defense, if as part of that defense HRNSW needs to produce new expert evidence to refute expert opinion produced by the McCarthy team at appeal so be it.

You have to remember its not 100 years ago that many Gallops Trainers in Queensland were penalised for positive Caffeine swabs which were all later found to be an error in the testing process hard to say here is your six months back.

I have always been just a little worried that we had 2 Boldernone positives in the one night from the one track it is a pretty amazing coincidence."

Brad you will find the Maclean newsagency in river street I think, for that lottery ticket.

Now HRNSW is in my view obligated to retest the swab from the Barry Lew horse. It was collected on the same night, in the same pan, under the same conditions as Luke Mc Carthy's horse, it is also an entire as I have said before the two on the same night to the same naturally occurring substance has always worried me.

Whatever unexplained chemical alteration took place,if the samples are still about then order a retest and put the issues to bed once and for all.

As VVV and I have yelled from the rooftops only to be drowned out...... not every positive swab means you are as labeled a drug cheat.

[Toni]

Nope, innocent until proven guilty as I said before the boldenone positive, after the boldenone positive and up until he was found guilty. Which is now innocent!

Just out of curiosity - did you view him as a "cheat" once he as found guilty in the first instance?

I didnt ever think he was guilty, I just didnt think there would be anyway someone would go to the major expense of appealing if they knew they were guilty, but thats just my personal opinion and I would understand that different people would have thought differently.

I also understand why people would just plead guilty, especially when it does cost so much to appeal so I guess it is a case of justice for those that can afford it. Its one of those unfortunate things - I just dont understand how this sort of thing can be avoided, especially considering the authorities are acting in the best interest of the sport.

[Thevoiceofreason]

I just hope this doesnt lead to people thinking they can now use it freely and then run the excuse that got Luke off.Im sure the other person who got done same time wont be happy but didnt he plead guilty.
Maybe its justice for those that can afford it and not for the rest.

I just checked if Barry Lew had pleaded guilty ..... that was not the case he was found guilty at both the initial stewards inquiry and the subsequent appeal.

[p plater]

The problem with the current process both here and in NZ is the Absolute Rule. Regardless of how a substance gets into the horse or in this case "when a Lab" says it found something, the trainer is instantly guilty of presenting a horse to race with the substance.
Now this case will put the cat among the pigeons and maybe they will revert to proving the trainer did it. This will cost HRNSW a bundle. Luke was found guilty of "presenting to race "
even his not guilty plea had no effect.
Yes it would cost a huge amount to appeal but if you know your innocent what else can you do.

[aussiebreno]

Just out of curiosity - did you view him as a "cheat" once he as found guilty in the first instance?

I didnt ever think he was guilty, I just didnt think there would be anyway someone would go to the major expense of appealing if they knew they were guilty, but thats just my personal opinion and I would understand that different people would have thought differently.

I also understand why people would just plead guilty, especially when it does cost so much to appeal so I guess it is a case of justice for those that can afford it. Its one of those unfortunate things - I just dont understand how this sort of thing can be avoided, especially considering the authorities are acting in the best interest of the sport.

To your first question, yes. I don't think I, or anybody else, can be blamed for thinking that. If others thought differently, kudos to them, and you are proven right (as if it was some kind of contest lol!).
For some reason I highly doubt McCarthy would care about me as an individual, but as a collective group bringing his name through the mud it must be tough (again, can't blame the group, conclusions were quite reasonable in the circumstances imo) I apologise for my part as above. I don't know if I publicly said anything but I sure thought/said it privately.

I do believe Triple V, Mightymo etc are moreso talking to the people who called McCarthy a cheat all along, even before any boldenone positive, and probably will still call him a cheat in months, years to come.

[Triple V]

I do believe Triple V, Mightymo etc are moreso talking to the people who called McCarthy a cheat all along, even before any boldenone positive, and probably will still call him a cheat in months, years to come.

[VVV] Breno, whilst I obviously cannot speak for Harvey, yes...that is exactly what I was doing. It was not aimed at you or even with you amongst others in mind. Rather, I was talking directly to those who would've relished the opportunity to have Luke outed for life for an Aspirin if they could have. Those are the gutless bastards who are squarely in my cross-hairs.

[Triple V]

Btw, worth a look at Trots TV tonight/tomorrow. Sam is on THERE with an interesting interview which might go a long way towards answering/explaining a lot of things. Recommended viewing.

[aussiebreno]

[VVV] Breno, whilst I obviously cannot speak for Harvey, yes...that is exactly what I was doing. It was not aimed at you or even with you amongst others in mind. Rather, I was talking directly to those who would've relished the opportunity to have Luke outed for life for an Aspirin if they could have. Those are the gutless bastards who are squarely in my cross-hairs.

I agree with those sentiments Jaimie.

[broncobrad]

If there is one thing I have picked up since joining this forum is learning that not everything is as it may seem. For one, I am sure Triple has risen from the abyss (from pissed-off-land) much sooner than any may have expected. More in keeping with the Jaimie that we know, comes the jam-this-humble-pie-down-your-throat "wheres the apologies you unbelievers" (you sort of miss his subtle cues when he ain't around).

Had to get the old grey matter around the fact that Luke McCarthy had beaten the charge. Confronting, yet when you look at the evidence (of what we have had revealed to us), HRNSW had absolutely no option but to not proceed any further. This is a ground-breaking finding, science evolving as we speak moment. I mean except for the eight experts who know way more shit than most of us simpler folk, who of us would have expected an outcome along these lines.

So when is a positive not a positive...(now I guess)...so who besides those 8 experts and Luke and VVV and TVOR, could possibly have foreseen this outcome. Not too many I reckon. Wasn't sure if I had attached the word cheat to Luke in this whole tawdry affair so spent most of the early evening checking ALL of my posts (how unrivetting has my night been), could not find anything that came close to it. Had a few observations including "Rumpole of the Bailey couldn't get him out of this one", "He would need to be just as good an escapologist as Harry Houdini", "No doubt the introduction of new evidence is the only way he could beat the charge" "Even if he had the lawyer to the stars Chris Murphy", "One move away from checkmate", blah blah blah. And to my utter surprise today the case is dropped.

So on the evidence that has gone before and the precedence of the Karloo Kix inquiry, with the guilty verdict finding coming down before it went to appeal, Luke had been found guilty, and (except for VVV and TVOR and Luke), I reckon a great majority of us could be forgiven if that is what we thought. So, publicly Jaimie, I have not stated he is a cheat, even after the earlier finding of guilty, but privately I may well have thought differently as some of us who wish to see the removal of cheats from the industry well know. So to those of you, don't think I have changed my position on this issue, I am simply accepting in this case that the current procedures got it wrong and an injustice may have been averted. I owe Luke no apology, indeed, was one of his greatest admirers until there was physical evidence to the contrary...and to be honest with you, right now I just don't know what to think.

Triple and Mightymo, I think you are right in the fact that those out and out knockers won't be lining up in a hurry to seek forgiveness, going over some of those old threads, so many of those contributors no longer frequent these pages by choice or because they have been removed.

Finally, something I came across on the Luke McCarthy Enquiry Adjourned thread, when the news broke of McCarthy being found guilty was something that came from Luke himself, see comment #23 "I don't have a lot of faith in the people in charge here or the judicial system"...it was this process that we have in place that gave him every opportunity to present his case to robustly defend himself.

Fair dinkum, who could, with hand over heart, have seen this result. Not I.

[Thevoiceofreason]

I said in an earlier post:

" Now HRNSW is in my view obligated to retest the swab from the Barry Lew horse. It was collected on the same night, in the same pan, under the same conditions as Luke Mc Carthy's horse, it is also an entire as I have said before the two on the same night to the same naturally occurring substance has always worried me.

Whatever unexplained chemical alteration took place,if the samples are still about then order a retest and put the issues to bed once and for all."

It is indeed pleasing to see that this has in fact already occurred and the results of that finding released in an interview with Sam Nati on trotstv today.

http://www.trotstv.com.au/?id=6716

Congratulations HRNSW on yet another job well done, I am nearly embarrassed to have thought you may not have already completed this task.

All tucked up nicely. Now how much is the first prize in that lottery