Tiered prizemoney in Victoria for new racing season

[aussiebreno]

Hi Kevin,


Whilst we did put a $750 bonus on these races in Sept/Oct last year to stimulate horse numbers for those months, we have to be mindful of not being seen to apply a bonus to circumvent HRAs limit of $3500 prizemoney for penalty-free races. Hence we decided rather than risk that perception, it was preferable to add a $1k bonus to the $5k races in May/June with approx 40 of those races conditioned for trainers with 25 or less wins in the prior year, (amongst other conditions aimed at avoiding uneven races).


In terms of $3500 races, as evident by the strong nominations at Bendigo last Sunday, there are a lot of people who do want to run in these races. There has been lengthy discussions in other social media forums about the need to retain these types of days.


Cheers, David

Sundays - a good chance for the hobby trainers who work full time during the week, who generally have lesser class horses, to race so the $3500 prizemoney seems like a good decision David!

[Messenger]

Sundays - a good chance for the hobby trainers who work full time during the week, who generally have lesser class horses, to race so the $3500 prizemoney seems like a good decision David!

I don't think we are having many hobby trainers win these races Brendan - especially the Monday at Melton $3,500 meets
My fear is that the 2nd level of pro trainers are being to forced to race for these lesser prizes as the big boys are dominating elsewhere and when you consider that these races sometimes attract as much turnover/income as higher class races, it does not seem much of a prize

[aussiebreno]

I don't think we are having many hobby trainers win these races Brendan - especially the Monday at Melton $3,500 meets
My fear is that the 2nd level of pro trainers are being to forced to race for these lesser prizes as the big boys are dominating elsewhere and when you consider that these races sometimes attract as much turnover/income as higher class races, it does not seem much of a prize

I do wonder why Victoria doesn't have a second Saturday night meeting like NSW does so maybe Sat night is the answer, but whether its Sat or Sun there does need to be racing on the weekend for the hobby trainers who work during the week. Unfortunately, as you point out, the bigger trainers still show up to these meetings but that can't really be helped. Maybe Sat night will stop a bit of that?

[Messenger]

I do wonder why Victoria doesn't have a second Saturday night meeting like NSW does so maybe Sat night is the answer, but whether its Sat or Sun there does need to be racing on the weekend for the hobby trainers who work during the week. Unfortunately, as you point out, the bigger trainers still show up to these meetings but that can't really be helped. Maybe Sat night will stop a bit of that?

Good point - I can see how a 2nd Saturday night meet would be far more likely to be ignored by the big boys. I imagine the authorities would however prefer to not double up as I would think it could hurt turnover.
I wonder whether there has ever been consideration given to having a meeting which excludes the big boys - I thought maybe the A grade / B grade trainer distinction but just about everybody seems to be an A grade trainer so I am not sure how you would do it

[Richard prior]

Very good point Brendan, I think Mildura would be an option for the second Saturday night meeting in Victoria, Keep a bit of distance between the meetings and the big guys would possibly avoid going to the 2nd meeting or go to one and not the other.

[arlington]

"Everyone seems to be an A Grade trainer" - pretty sure the criteria has changed recently in that it's now a little similar to the N Z set up. B Grade trainers can now also train up to 3 horses for outside clients with the permission of the stewards, where they couldn't train any previously.
However, unless the licencing fees were significantly different (now the same fee) and/or race/meeting programming suited, I couldn't see why people would relinquish their A Grade licence.
Brings in the silent part of the discussion, the lack of noms for the $7000 races. Will keep an eye out for some Sunday "25 or 2 wins and under" $7000 races.

[Messenger]

Very good point Brendan, I think Mildura would be an option for the second Saturday night meeting in Victoria, Keep a bit of distance between the meetings and the big guys would possibly avoid going to the 2nd meeting or go to one and not the other.

Although the trouble with Mildura is that apart from its once a year carnival (on now) - it is so far from anywhere else, that they have their own little comp between themselves. It is even 4hr+ with a float from 'nearby' Horsham

[Messenger]

Although my concern with $3,500 meets is about participants receiving adequate prizemoney for putting on the show
an astute reader friend has pointed out to me that "we have to supplement feature races and juvenile races from somewhere"
while summarizing my concern as "R races shouldn't be paid trials for the best horses in the big stables"

[arlington]

Although my concern with $3,500 meets is about participants receiving adequate prizemoney for putting on the show
an astute reader friend has pointed out to me that "we have to supplement feature races and juvenile races from somewhere"
while summarizing my concern as "R races shouldn't be paid trials for the best horses in the big stables"

HRV have conditioned a lot of the paid trials for the best horses in the big stables out of the $3500 races. Kudos there.

As for the concern with $3500 races being an inadequate prize money level, agreed, but they are non penalty( R penalty only) and that is an attraction for all participants if you don't need to travel far - the attraction for the professional Melton trainers to Melton R programs/races? Maybe they charge owners reduced rates for R races?

You also need to consider what D Martin has emphasised, HRV would be stretching it, at odds with HRA policy on increasing prize money levels for R, non penalty racing.

I would think, or would like to think, the recent announcement of the $1000 bonus for $5000 C races has been funded by the R races and not directed to funding feature races.
That $5000 tier is a big problem being a C penalty. Whether there could be more R, conditioned heats, leading to $7000 finals?

[David Martin]

HRV have conditioned a lot of the paid trials for the best horses in the big stables out of the $3500 races. Kudos there.

As for the concern with $3500 races being an inadequate prize money level, agreed, but they are non penalty( R penalty only) and that is an attraction for all participants if you don't need to travel far - the attraction for the professional Melton trainers to Melton R programs/races? Maybe they charge owners reduced rates for R races?

You also need to consider what D Martin has emphasised, HRV would be stretching it, at odds with HRA policy on increasing prize money levels for R, non penalty racing.

I would think, or would like to think, the recent announcement of the $1000 bonus for $5000 C races has been funded by the R races and not directed to funding feature races.
That $5000 tier is a big problem being a C penalty. Whether there could be more R, conditioned heats, leading to $7000 finals?

Thanks Wayne. The $1k bonus on $5k races in May/June, means that a win for these C penalty races will give prizemoney to winning connections similar to a $7k penalty race. Being $5k races, they are generally conditioned to give the lower class horses a run. We have also conditioned aprox 40 of these races to suit trainers who were less successful than others in the prior season (i.e. trainers with 2 or less wins and trainers with 25 or less wins).