Jamie, you are sarting to sound like a PR spokesperson for Pepper Tree. Artistic Fella a 3-headed gorilla- you are joking.
[VVV] He stands at Empire.... and no Viv, I'm not joking. 1:49 & a piece over 1 & 1/4miles is not for mine the effort of a single-headed gorilla.
Can't be the same Artistic Fella I saw in the flesh in the Breeders Crown elim and final. Beaten and well beaten both times.
[VVV] Bzzzzzz. He won the Breeders Crown Final in 1:49.4.
A lovely racehorse but having seen both in the flesh I don't know how you can honestly say he was that much better than Auckland Reactor.
If you lined them up side by side, physically there is also no comparison. Artistic Fella is a very imposing individual. Auckland Reactor is not.
And at best he has made a promising start to his siring career. From 80+ foals, he has 2 really nice fillies and bugger all else.
[VVV] In terms of numbers & mare quality, from relatively limited opportunities as compared to his contemporaries he has 80 current 2yo foals, 9 individual 2yo winners, 5 of them in 2:00.7 or faster & a season's leading $$$ earning & fastest (1:55.4) 2yo filly in AUS. Incidentally that's the 4th fastest mile paced by a 2yo thus far this season & it's easily the fastest paced by a 2yo filly this season. Not bad.
In Nz he was that highly regarded he served 9 mares.
[VVV] Ahuh. Well Viv, getting down to tin tacks here....
I'd have to seriously question NZ breeding decisions at any time as being anything even remotely approaching that which could be termed as being a reliable indicator of subsequent siring success let alone being anything that any AUS breeder should seek to hang their hats upon.
Not so long ago NZ breeders lined up in their droves & they sent a swag of good mares & some very good mares to Elsu and ended up with nothing to show for it whatsoever.
There is a prevailing mood these days in both Nz +Aust to judge horses on how they perform in your own back yard. I am as guilty of it as any one else. My opinion of Artistic Fella was based on what I saw in the flesh.
[VVV] I'm a bit confused here Viv.
In your own back yard? I think maybe you're confusing the horse with another.
Artistic Fella won 7 or 8 straight, maybe more, in deep & against the best around as a 3yo at The Meadowlands. Do you live in New Jersey?
As I recall The Meadowlands thought so much of the horse when he retired they gave him an official send off.
To my knowledge Artistic Fella has never once set foot in anger on any racetrack anywhere in the Southern Hemisphere, NZ or AUS....although I recall he may have been taken to Shepparton & paraded one night soon after his arrival in Australia.
Mr Feelgood is another who suffers from not performing to the same level everywhere he raced. Outstanding in both the Usa+Aust but an 11 start non winner in Nz.
For what ever reason Mr Feelgood just didnt race anywhere near his true ability in Nz.
[VVV] Wasn't discussing him...although I recall that when he arrived here in Australia from NZ for the first time, physically he looked terrible and his feet were a disgrace. The horse raced infinitely better & more successfully when he went back under Luke's care, recording close-up 2nds to ITMQ, Smoken Up etc. in big $$$ races.
Do you write him off as a sire prospect in Nz?.
[VVV] No, however...to be frank, who really cares what happens/will happen in NZ these days? It is irrelevant & increasingly so.
It has been quite a while now since a NZ Stud has put their hand in their pocket and secured a genuine top shelf, high profile straight off the race track horse. Think about it.
In the general time frame as the likes of Rock N Roll Heaven, Sportswriter, Shadow Play, Somebeachsomewhere, Rocknroll Hanover, Artistic Fella etc. have come to stand stud here AUS...Big Jim was the single notable import to NZ.
No but it does play a part when assessing potential sires for the coming season.
[VVV] Mr Feelgood has been available for a while now & winners wise he already has a few runs on the board. I would have thought you'd assess him on that?
Auckland Reactor draws exactly the same reaction from Australians as Mr Feelgood does from Kiwis. What they saw in their backyard was not at the same level as he performed in Nz or to the level they expected. So they rate him accordingly.
[VVV] For a horse of his calibre & ownership Mr Feelgood was not in particularly good shape when he arrived here for the first time from NZ, moving from his NZ trainer to Luke MCarthy. The apparent level of care that had been lavished upon him over there appeared to leave much to be desired. He raced infinitely better here in Australia and went back over to NZ under the care of an Australian Trainer and raced infinitely better than he had raced when first in NZ under the care of an NZ trainer. Imagine that eh?
I saw him race in Nz numerous times and have no doubt that Auckland Reactor during his 3+4yr old campaigns in Nz was very very special. As good as anything to race here in my lifetime. And that will be reflected in the number of mares he serves this year in Nz.
[VVV] The question initially asked was how many mares he might serve in AUS. As I said above, who cares what he does or does not do in NZ. You guys jumped on the Elsu bandwagon too & got left holding steaming bags of the brown stuff.
I have no doubt he will serve a 200+ book in Nz. Pricing him at $3000 was an invitation most Nz breeders will struggle to refuse.
[VVV] Viv, for someone given to reading between the lines such as myself, that means things are a bit tight $$ wise, the NZ Studs have set the standard by looking inwards to fill their Rosters and the Scottish Presbyterian heritage of so many of our breeders will take the tip/similarly come to the fore.
And in Aust - At that price he will serve more than 20 but no where near what he will serve on this side of the Tasman.
[VVV] Rightly or wrongly... and largely through no fault of his own, the horse a potential sire profile that's on par with a Bondi Cigar. If he serves more than 20 mares here I'd be stunned.
The one thing I had a query about was his fertility but when I spoke to Alabar they assured me that a part of the reason for pricing him at $3000 was they were very confident that he would handle a large book with ease.
[VVV] Good luck to them. They did the same with Elsu and with Gotta Go Cullect now that I think of it. If the horse has it he will do it. Glad it's not my money just the same.
The one thing i would completely agree with Jamie is that stallions have either got it or they havn't.
[VVV] Common ground at last.