Reply With Quotewhat john said was great, he knew what he was talking and didnt held back when most gutless people would. is their any where on line to se the report
There was an interesting interview with long time industry member John Hallam on Harness review this week
https://soundcloud.com/user-46112780...5th-april-2016
Tune in from about the 40 min mark if you only wish to here JH's interview
In discussing the merits of a tiered racing system, John pointed out a few things that many may not realize eg
There will be 800 less Country front races and 800 more Restricted class races
He fears that such a tiered system will not work - that the good horses/big stables will not skip over these Restricted class races but rather work their way through them - resulting in more, not less, Odds On faves
He emphasized that participants have to be able to get a reasonable return
I totally agree with his point that restricted class racing at Melton cheapens what is supposed to be our Premier track (can you imagine the gallops doing this to Flemington)
It was alarming that he believes the rank and file trainers and drivers are still not really being heard and stated that while Lance Justice is being quoted as supporting the system - as their representative, the association has not had a meeting for 18 months! (JH said that Lance was in NZ when contacted and not yet aware of the details of the proposed system)
In JH's opinion the continued strengthening of the Vicbred Bonus system is essential
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
what john said was great, he knew what he was talking and didnt held back when most gutless people would. is their any where on line to se the report
Last edited by jackthepunter; 04-30-2016 at 06:56 PM.
i really now believe that hrv must get rid of the breeders crown and put all the money into the vicbred 2-3 series and vicbred bonus.
Vaughn Lynch, General manager of operations spends a half hour with Cody answering questions about tiered racing
http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=29701
To summarize:
It is all about addressing the decline in our horse population
The new advisory council were generally positive about it at their very first meeting but admittedly did not have all the details
Social media tends to attract negative opinions but he receives positive (a bit dismissive when you consider that social media posts are actually substantiated opinions)
The pie is just being cut up differently - there are 800 races getting less but 2000 getting more
As far as more R races producing more odds on faves he had stats that R races have less odds on faves
He suggested that 'conditions' would be used to stop the picking of low hanging fruit
R racing does not produce less turnover and to improve turnover we need full fields, even racing (punters see value) and full fields, which is what they are trying to do
As Steve suggested in another thread - it is all about turnover but Vaughan states that is then returned to the industry (they are a not for profit organization)
In reply to Andy Gath's suggestion that the majority of the industry think this scheme is doomed, he said that they will always be listening and tinkering but it is about competing for the gambling dollar (he did however earlier suggest that this system would have to be given at least a year for a fair trial)
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
Social media is the modern day version of a letter to the editor or a hard hitting cover story in Trembath's Trotting Weekly.
On the video Vaughn suggests that the existing prize-money structure is a socialist system but maybe it should be
Further on he states that there is no discernible difference between turnover on R and C class races so maybe they should receive comparable prizemoney
Think of it like commission work - if you are bringing in the dollars then you are entitled to your share
The worry is whether the grassroots trainer can survive. This will depend on whether they can win as much prizemoney ie as many R&C races or 2+ R races for every C they used to win. This would seem to be dependent on whether the bigger stables will concentrate on the C class races or whether they will attempt to corner both C&R. I fear they may do both
Using Vaughn's pie analogy
If there used to be 400 large pieces 2400 medium pieces and 800 small pieces
but now there is to be
400 very large pieces, 1600 medium+ pieces and 1600 small pieces
I think the bigger stables will eat more small pieces to keep their bellies full
If we lose smaller grassroots trainers I fear we not only have less people involved in the sport but also loose followers/owners from the communities from which they came.
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
Maybe tiered racing might see the bigger trainers leave the minor meetings to the smaller stables if tomorrow's Melton Restricted program became the pattern.
There are only 3 of Vics top 10 trainers represented by a mere 7 runners with 4 of them coming from our 10th placed trainer G Douglas
IMO it is a bit of a worry that he is becoming strong again after such a lenient suspension for such a dubious act
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
The scheme will now have 4 tiers (5 if you add Metro) with the creation of a $5k tier seemingly an improvement
http://www.harness.org.au/news-artic...?news_id=29999
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
Looking at the 1st race C3 at Maryborough today with Heavens Trend a $1.04 fav
It made me wonder whether with different C3 tiers whether a horse like HT nominating (for a top tier C3) - would the race be more or less likely to hold up?
For lesser nominees the 'pro' would be the top tiers greater place prize money - the 'con' would be the appeal of a win in a lower tier C3
per un PUGNO di DOLLARI
Originally Posted by Messenger
The new scheme does seem more thoughtful and you've brought up some of the great unknown's Kev, but, I feel, the new tiered scheme is more likely to address the short price objective more so than the initial tiered scheme. Happier to give this scheme a go and see what happens.
There will be quite a few things to consider when entering any horse and will be dependant on the horse's future race program. Considering the perspective of the classy 3yo filly getting ready for the Vicbred Super Series is a fairly unique example to look at. Would you want to take on the better/seasoned Tier 1 or even 2 horses and possibly flatten her? Will also depend on which races are programmed at a particular time to suit her program.
For a lot of horses it may well be a question of owners working out if paying the daily training fees for a fit horse waiting for a top tier race is worth the wait?? But then again if they punt and get the better odds....
And the timing of the introduction of the scheme, being September 1, will see a lot of the better aged group racehorses out spelling, a different ball game to what we can propose now, and of course will change when they re-enter the system.
I think it's time to get a bit excited about the what if's and hat's off to Vaughn Lynch and Co. Under the pump but keeping things fluid. Maybe the way Tiered racing was introduced was planned. Throw it out there and get people thinking. I dare say Vaughn and Co got more "feedback" than sending out a survey beforehand.
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