Reply With Quotesmithy, Stallions do help our breeding industry. Nz racehorses don't. I didn't mention banning anything. I can't see anything ludicrous about my statement, you just don't seem to understand it.
Where does it say ban nz horses in my statement ?
how about kiwi stallions CUF and christain cullen..mach three stands there too - we better ban them because they are kiwi horse.. while we are at lets ban all the US horses and stallions .. because we don't want our money going overseasOriginally Posted by gutwagon
see the ludicrousness of this idea
smithy, Stallions do help our breeding industry. Nz racehorses don't. I didn't mention banning anything. I can't see anything ludicrous about my statement, you just don't seem to understand it.
Where does it say ban nz horses in my statement ?
Smithy. Unfortunately the above is a too common theme amongst harness racing participants in Australia. It is a mentality that will see the sport continue its downward slide in most states, NSW exempt of that.
Problem is in harness racing in general is that many - well certainly a high proportion - have a seriously delusional view of the industry, and their niche within it. Breeders are one that sit on some other plane alltogether. You only need to waltz around a yearling sale, any yearling sale and hear the delusion bellow from the boxes with the ridiculous expectations placed on their horses. Harness Breeders are habitual over-valuers. Both ones that go to the sales and ones that don't.
If they are one and the same it would be imposible to support one and not the other. Your statement contradicts its self.
Last edited by gutwagon; 07-28-2011 at 10:54 PM. Reason: spelling
I do agree that many breeders want way too much for thier yearlings, they should let the market determin the value of thier stock. They are just the same in NZ.
G'day The Big Mile,
Mate, just one thing that's worth noting in relation to the Oz Yearling Sale values and in particular, the biggest sale here...the APG as compared to buying going horses out of NZ.
Going horses from NZ are NOT eligible for the APG, NSW Breeders Challenge etc...in fact for the most part they're not eligible for a whole lot at all...and this, combined with a 26-27% & sometimes as high as 30% kick in the Fx means that NZ going horses can be purchased rather advantageously as compared to their Oz bred compatriots.
I don't for one minute doubt that the going concern end of the market here in Oz is more often than not overpriced however to be totally fair you really need to compare apples to apples if you're looking to aim up on relative asking prices.
An Oz bred yearling that's sold in the APG and is eligible for a swag of futurities has one price tag relative to its earning potential while an NZ bred going concern with few if any futurity eligibilities has another.
no but im representing the owners here, and by banning US stallions the aussie stallions will be worth more...so breeders will just have to cop it because its good for owners
does this idea still not seem totally stupid?
how does making horses more expensive help owners who don't sell at yearling sales? this report is aimed directly at supporting the yearling sales breeders/sellers - not ordinary breeders who race their own stock who are under pressure from rising costs
it looks imo like its trying to bring back the nsw sires stakes program which is dead and buried
the report makes absolutely no difference between yearlings and going horses - they are clearly different products and if people want going horses they will simply buy 5+ mares.. and then watch the kiwi horses win all the races when they get handicapping kickbacks when their imported
Last edited by smithy; 07-28-2011 at 09:30 PM.
Triple VVVV: What is proposed is something that will tax a certain percentage of OWNERS, to meet the shortcomings of the breeding industry.
That includes all breeders as all will be eligible.
You breeders (well I am actually one, but I am a breeder whom is generally appalled by the constant 'help me, help me' cries that bellow from the breeding industry) need to realise if you want to make your(our) progeny more attractive, then what you need are BUYERS. BUYERS = OWNERS.
The industry at large has done a large slice of very little in trying to attract new owners. Where do they go generally to seek horses? NZ. A-la the Number One Club.
What YOU blokes need to do is create a culture of cultivating the owners within the industry that breeding is worth a tilt, or at least a gamble at the yearling sales. But do not discourage their general interest in the game by silly things like excessive Import fees.
Problem is, investing in yearlings is a gamble that rarely pays off. The term 'you may as well slit your wrists' is commonly bandied around and given my experience at yearling sales, that rings pretty true.
You can only bleed owners for so much.
Am I meant to be sympathetic towards breeders whom should have culled poor broodmares years ago but persist with them?
The Credit Scheme could easily see more of this happen - persistence with poor mares at the races then at stud. Is it a good thing? Well if we need two headed gorillas on the race track so punters can wager on them, so be it.
Maybe the drops in foals in recent years is evolution in motion, the culling of the weakest.
This report was about the breeding industry in Australia, not about owners, they may get their own report one day.
So you blokes think Aus breeders should just give it all away and all owners just buy from NZ. You seem to think you cant buy going horses in Aus, only overpriced yearlings ! I know several people who paid good money for nz horses and had very little luck. They then brough Aus stock and are doing much better, it can work both ways.
And Smithy nobody wants to ban US or NZ stallions. Nowhere in the report do they suggest this, they only recomend increasing the import fee on racing stock from o/s, to encourage owners to buy Australian.Also if there are no breeders there will be no owners !
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