BOOM.....McCarthy Positive.

[teecee]

I am only posting what is on the public record.

You should be posting what is the public record...i.e. your source official article.
Please read and follow the forum rules as outlined on the Australian Harness Forum Home page.
If you are not able to supply a source within your post it will be regarded as not official but another case of innuendo. Then deleted.

[The Rainmaker]

[VVV] See, now there you go playing fast and rather loose with the facts once again Eric.
I most certainly did say that Peter is a nice bloke.
He is a nice bloke. I stand by that.
In all the time I've known him he has always been a pleasant, friendly fella.
I did however go on to say that, like so many other such people that I had met, I found it hard to reconcile the Peter that I knew as a nice bloke with the one who has recorded repeat TCO2 offences & so on...which you conveniently left out or forgot to mention.

Your view of the world in general in terms of legal matters is apparently one where there is the presumption of guilt until one is proven innocent...which as luck would have it for both Luke & Barry, is completely at odds with the Judicial system that this country works on. Fancy that eh? Bugger. The Law has gone & stuffed up a perfectly good Lynching Party.

Whichever way you want to look at it, both horses under the care of these two trainers returned positive swabs, which was verified by two labratories. At this stage they are positive swabs according to media releases from HRNSW, they came out with the statement no-one else. And if it turns out they were contaminated and both trainers are not guilty well thats HRNSW's problem for jumping the gun and dragging their names through the mud.

P.S That Cam Fitzpatrick is a lovely bloke too, wheres he now? You're a great judge of character

[teecee]

I find it rather ironic that someone can take a rather and ill informed view of NZ laws claiming protection of their opinion under the law through the right of freedom of expression and opinion. Views expressed on this forum are NOT protected under NZ law when they are without base or foundation. This is why when claims are made on this forum without factual backup they will be deleted.

NZ Law does however strongly protect the accused until the law, not the court of public opinion, has found their case proven.
NZ law says that these two accused persons are innocent until their opportunity to defend has been exhausted.
Your opinion is at odds with this principle and as it is not based on proven fact your opinion is tenuous at best...Not VALID.

With that in mind you are advised your post 109 is "close to the edge" in labelling them CHEATS.

[The Rainmaker]

I find it rather ironic that someone can take a rather and ill informed view of NZ laws claiming protection of their opinion under the law through the right of freedom of expression and opinion. Views expressed on this forum are NOT protected under NZ law when they are without base or foundation. This is why when claims are made on this forum without factual backup they will be deleted.

NZ Law does however strongly protect the accused until the law, not the court of public opinion, has found their case proven.
NZ law says that these two accused persons are innocent until their opportunity to defend has been exhausted.
Your opinion is at odds with this principle and as it is not based on proven fact your opinion is tenuous at best...Not VALID.

With that in mind you are advised your post 109 is "close to the edge" in labelling them CHEATS.

I refer you to the following articles:

http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=95717

http://www.harnesslink.com/www/Article.cgi?ID=95685

Both written by your very own journalist Dale Walker. Both indicate said trainers have obtained positive swabs.

Without such articles posted on harnesslink I would have nothing to base my expression of opinion on. If you want to delete my post that's fine, however your articles are the basis of where I formed my views so you may want to delete them as well.

[Maorisidol]

Whichever way you want to look at it, both horses under the care of these two trainers returned positive swabs, which was verified by two labratories. At this stage they are positive swabs according to media releases from HRNSW, they came out with the statement no-one else. And if it turns out they were contaminated and both trainers are not guilty well thats HRNSW's problem for jumping the gun and dragging their names through the mud.

P.S That Cam Fitzpatrick is a lovely bloke too, wheres he now? You're a great judge of character

I'm with u here VVV,

Eric, the 2 guys have been charged but essentially not found guilty and convicted yet, and u are happy to call them cheats...

[teecee]

Thanks for you article links. I can't find the term or inference CHEAT in either article in reference to either trainer.
Neither article states that charges have been laid, hearings held, nor convictions and penalties entered.
For you to claim protection by NZ law for your opinion as stated and published on the forum would IMO be far from safe.

[broncobrad]

You should be posting what is the public record...i.e. your source official article.
Please read and follow the forum rules as outlined on the Australian Harness Forum Home page.
If you are not able to supply a source within your post it will be regarded as not official but another case of innuendo. Then deleted.

Hi Teecee,

If I have erred in not posting the source I humbly apologise, but I can assure you I have no intention of posting unfounded or unconfirmed facts. Its not my go.
It was posted on the front of Harnesslink from the Newsroom at 2:27Pm on 15/02/2012 for all to see. Would have posted earlier but had to play indoor soccer.

[The Rainmaker]

Thanks for you article links. I can't find the term or inference CHEAT in either article in reference to either trainer.
Neither article states that charges have been laid, hearings held, nor convictions and penalties entered.
For you to claim protection by NZ law for your opinion as stated and published on the forum would IMO be far from safe.

I read the headings of both articles as 'Positive Swab for Luke McCarthy' and 'Positive Swab for Barry Lew', on the harnesslink top stories feed. Nowhere in those headings did I read impending positive or potential positive. If in fact neither trainer have a positive, both articles prove to be incorrect, and having based my opinion on said articles from a trustworthy source, I would suggest harnesslink have more to answer for incorrect reporting that I do for expressing a view on which those headings were the basis.


P.S Thanks for the heads up Adam.

[teecee]

1. Seems alot of posters were banned after having a potshot at McCarthy after his positive swab came to light the other day, or if it was one person under multiple aliases it shoots your theory in the foot that every man and his dog were on McCarthy's hammer.

The number of members posting to this issue in a negative manner necessitating moderator intervention supports this figurative view.

Four persons were banned with regards to what was posted on here two days ago.
I banned all of them.
None of them was banned for taking potshots at McCarthy. All had ppreviously posted sensible and thoughtful posts on the issue.
All were banned for offensive language unrelated to the issue for discussion and making insulting remarks when replying to the views of other members whose views they disagreed with.
On further examination it was found that these persons were aliases for one or two persons.

2. Another poster this afternoon said they made a post about Barry Lew's Boldenone positive only to have it deleted by a moderator.

I also did that. The post did not offer any form of ratification and as such I judged to be hearsay.
If you have read the rules it says you need to back up with evidence what you write in a post WITHIN THAT POST.

3. The so called 'Peanut Gallery' have been on the money in recent times in regards to:

* Bennett and Fitzpatrick and co being involved in the swabbing scandal - CORRECT
* Luke McCarthy's results pointing to potential steroid/drug use - CORRECT
* His mate Barry Lew using the same substance - CORRECT

All before public announcements were made. If the 'Peanut Gallery' is the name given to those on the money I'd hate to see what those people would be known as if they were incorrect. Not to mention that you personally knew all those rumours as well, if you didn't believe them what does it make you?

4. Luke McCarthy and Barry Lew are both cheats as far as I'm concerned, history shows they both recorded a positive swab to Boldenone.

Members are free to make whatever speculations they like elsewhere at risk of legal sanction.
To make them here you need to be able to back it up as you say/write it.
Being right about it after the event does not protect anybody for what they said or wrote prior.

[Danno]

Members are free to make whatever speculations they like elsewhere at risk of legal sanction.
To make them here you need to be able to back it up as you say/write it.
Being right about it after the event does not protect anybody for what they said or wrote prior.

So, forgive me if I'm wrong does that mean when triple says our game's administrators should get their heads out of their arses ( see yearling sales threrad) should he include digital images of people with their heads up their arse? or would a "stat dec" suffice? or alternatively, can we take triples word for it because he's a moderator?

Just trying to clear up the rules TC

Cheers,
Dan