Really Kev, you think HRV can’t come up with the idea of free or discounted services for themselves? ( or reading the forum)
And yes we are increasingly being bumped when we are on time but the other codes are experiencing delays putting them behind and us being shifted because of it.
But I guess we should be grateful to Sky for allowing us to have trotsvision
Last edited by Dot; 07-27-2019 at 10:38 PM.
Why are you so sure that they can?Originally Posted by Dot
Why should we assume they are considering it?
Do you think the 'drivers' of the HRV bus have been heading in the right direction for the last few decades?
PS Might need facts and figures again Dot
I decided to check out Sky for a race - just saw Toowoomba gallops bumped because they were late and we were ready to go
PS2 But I wonder how many non-enthusiasts know Vision exists
Overall, I think the 'bumping excuse' is overdone
Greg Sugars was a Champion harness racing person
Well they have been handing out free services to Kevin Seymour’s stallions for some mares races now Kev for over 18 months, and the free service is included in the race conditions so someone at HRV must be across the idea that free services are desirable. I’m not assuming they’re considering it further, I’m assuming they aren’t considering it further because they’ve spent their powder on the certificates they’ve awarded.
Do I think the drivers of the HRV bus have been heading in the right direction the last few decades? Sometimes yes, sometimes no, and sometimes the bus has had to follow the road laid out for it.
On your first PS, I don’t have Sky but I’ll see your Toowoomba and raise you two previously at Cobram:
David Martin
@DavidMartinAU1
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Jul 10
Replying to
@simbarroo
@maree_newberry
and 3 others
Unfortunately it's due to preferential Sky arrangements that disadvantage #Trots coverage through to 2024. Not much good talking about changing to drivers colours if they're running around on the blue screen through no fault of our own as has happened to Cobram twice today.
I can actually remember being outraged at unfair bumps
It would be interesting to quantify what it actually costs the industry
The biggest outrage is for home viewers who watch through Foxtel and do not have Sky2.
I wonder whether this is really very many? Very many watching through foxtel that is
There should be lobbying to include Sky2 into the basic package or at least the Sports package - the fee of $60 is pretty insignificant but it is not going to occur to non-enthusiasts to even consider it
It would be interesting to know how many people have Sky2 - it would take 1 click for Foxtel to tell us
If I did not have it, I know I can get it on the Sky website
Maybe Sky2 will come to the new Kayo Sports?
What about all of you that watch racing through an app provided by a betting agency - do you get Sky2 or is that the blue screen you refer to?
Those in a TAB of course, only have to look at a different TV screen when a bump occurs
Greg Sugars was a Champion harness racing person
Taken from the April 2019 CEO Report (assuming this it the April 2019 CEO "update") as partially quoted in this thread - If HRV chose not to run races on Sky 1 it would result in approximately 40 per cent less turnover, making those meetings unviable.
Additionally, The only Victorian harness races guaranteed to be run on Sky 1 are Group 1 races.
As well as - Existing arrangements also mean that Sky determines which codes run in various timeslots (e.g. only thoroughbred racing on Sky 1 for Saturday daytime) and individual race times for each meeting.
I received the Harness Racer in April and read the full CEO Report then. Having previously read the Annual Report, I didn't think we'd been misled.
From your post 4 Kev, "Plus administrators who do not seem to be listening or drawing on the ideas of those older than 30 too".
Can't agree with that in Victoria. Have seen a number of participants over 30 deep in conversation with the CEO at the races as well as the bulk of the attendees at the CEO roadshows being over 30 and being listened to. And not just in one ear and out the other. What actually has been disappointing is the lack of under 30's, that we have, attending the roadshows.
Having written the above, and considering what Ray wrote, "The Inaugural HRA National Conference was held on Friday 14 December 2018 at Flemington Racecourse and is being hailed a success.... It is now 7 months since the conference was held and no full review has been published".
I totally agree, we should have seen something from HRA by now. Especially as the youth forum was also held.
That sounds to me like a 40% turnover drop IF a meet was scheduled to be on Sky 2 - NOT what the drop is if a race is bumped to Sky 2, often after the scheduled start time
Greg Sugars was a Champion harness racing person
Given the context of where and why it was included in the full "update", it does give an indication of how damaging it is. You're suggesting we've got our knickers in a knot over nothing Kev?
I don't use Sky 2. Rarely watch a race on my phone. I used to head into the house to catch a race I was interested in through the day but don't bother now because of the bumps.
I prefer Sky 1 over trots vision. Too late and a hassle arcing up the laptop or pc to catch part of the race.
I find the 40% reduction figure large for a last minute bump (maybe even for if a meeting was scheduled on Sky2)
If that is the bump %, it suggests that 60% of our punters/turnover are casual observers.
I base this on the fact that owner/stable connections are going to back it regardless
Pro punters and others that have been following a particular horse are not going to be put off
Those on course are going to still bet
and therefore the 40% drop is loss of casuals
I then say this is suggesting the Casual observer percentage is in the order of 60% for:
Some casuals are not going to be lost as they have Sky2 or only have to look at the 'other screen' in the TAB when there is a bump (or phone app caters for this - I do not about this as I am not a phone person)
And at least 10% of the 60% turnover that still eventuates would have to be casuals who have already put their bet on before the last minute bump
I find 60% way too high for casuals and would think those groups I listed in the previous paragraph to be at least 60% of turnover not casuals
It would be interesting to have some research but for the above reasons I find it hard to believe a bump costs us 40%
It would not be hard to research you would just need somebody to asterisk every time a race is bumped
Somehow, I doubt anybody in the harness industry or even Sky is doing that and so the 40% is just an estimate
That is - if it is even the 'bump' figure.
Far easier to do the maths (even retrospectively) if it is the figure for meets scheduled for Sky2
Last edited by Messenger; 07-29-2019 at 12:13 PM.
Greg Sugars was a Champion harness racing person
More from the Equine Excellence report of 10yrs ago:
If anything the sport has abandoned its core follower attraction of a glamorous exciting and exhilarating sporting entertainment experience and its differentiation from thoroughbred racing (close to the action) in favour of industry focussed and driven initiatives
These include the introduction of some unnecessarily large tracks and/or tracks which are located in less convenient and less attractive population precincts further removed from ancillary entertainment activities of the big cities
In comparison with the sport in its’ hey day harness racing now generally offers a lack lustre boring entertainment experience in the minds of today’s mainstream sporting entertainment market
And the result - they vote with their feet and no longer attend
But it’s great for the industry players especially if their priority is total self interest and no interest whatsoever of the importance of sporting audiences at large (who couldn’t care less if a horse ran 1.59.0 or 1.52.0 especially if they are on a track so big can’t even see how their fancy is going)
Essentially harness racing today puts on the show for itself and seems happy to leave it at that
One of the Harness Racing’s most critical issues is the lack of public awareness and interest in actually attending harness racing
Who cares?
The industry is more about the punter and TAB turnover than it is about attracting on course patronage according to most industry administrators
And bigger tracks and faster times are a necessity, say most industry participants
In my view both have their priorities wrong
The accepted and unchecked decline in public attendance is one of the major fundamental reasons behind the industry’s failure to maintain its once prominent position in the Australian sporting scene
The blame for this lies fairly and squarely on the shoulders of the sport’s executive administrators, past and present – those that have been paid and rewarded to develop and grow the sport on your behalf
They have failed in this duty as will the industry itself if it fails to demand immediate and dramatic change across every facet of the sport starting at the very top
Why is public attendance so vital?
Simply because potential new outside recruits to the industry have to actually experience and become emotionally involved in harness racing before they take the next step to participation
No new industry recruits means no more industry, nothing for the punters to bet on, no need for the big tracks and no use for fast race records
And at present the industry product is not capable of attracting anywhere near the number of new non industry connected recruits to maintain the viability of Harness Racing into the future
Greg Sugars was a Champion harness racing person
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